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Political Thread: The Sequel

Windergawx said:
its the fighting age males and inmates we dont need no country has ever had a swinging door policy and lasted but im sure its different this time
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Correct and most of them coming over are indeed MAM's. It's an invasion directed by the left side of our government and the cartels. It's about power and control and nothing more to these people. It's truly a shame that some people can't see this because they choose not to
 
Why don't we make this simple? Can one of you lefties explain why open borders and unfettered migration/immigration is a good thing? And to make sure we're all on the same page, by unfettered I am not talking about the people go who through the legal, established process. I'm talking about the ones who sneak in and we don't know who they are.

And I'm taking the classic and false rebuttal of "But this is only a very rare occurrence and only accounts for 0.000000000000001% of people crossing the border" off the table.

And also, let's have none of the classic Russian whataboutism "But Trump blah blah blah....."

Can someone tell me why this is a good thing for our country? I'm seriously asking.
 
ChrisAMB said:
Where we disagree is using hyperbole to describe the situation. We aren’t being overrun. That’s nonsense.

Involving other nations in our immigration strategy means we partner with them to help solve the issues that send their citizens here in the first place. It doesn’t mean cutting them a blank check. Foreign aid is soft power and if we cede that to isolationism tendencies the Chinese will be in our backyard quickly. Most every proposal I’ve seen from the R side doesn’t address this at all and comically the R House attempted to strip a provision from the recent immigration bill that would expand pre-employment verification of eligibility.
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You don't get it and you aren't going to so it's probably a waste of my time. We are being overrun because I have seen it. If you don't believe me ask the people who are down there every single day who will tell you the exact same thing I am telling you
 
Sandbar said:
Because I am allowed an opinion. Or is that no longer valid either? I fought to protect your right to have one as well. If this evil is allowed to continue you won't have my opinion to have to worry about. That's the beauty of living in what used to be the bastion of freedom. The door swings both ways and I have no qualms about moving on. Most don't have the luxury to do that and I hate it for them but I'm not gonna stand for it and I am done fighting for problems that I didn't create. What is happening in America right now today is the furthest from compromise that I have ever seen
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The issue is by stating your opinion you attempt to speak for “the people.” Call it your opinion and leave it at that.

The topic of lowering the political temperature in the country comes up often and this is a good example. Declaring your political opponents in religious terms “evil” and attempting to frame them as “others” doesn’t help to bring people together to find common ground. It’s quite sad to me to see other people think they’re losing freedoms just because someone else now has the freedom to live as they choose. I’m more “free” to live as I choose than my father was at my age. Same for him and his father. I hope my children think the same in the future.
 
I'm sorry but when more people than live in the state of North Carolina, show up illegally in less than a 3 year span. That's Called Being Overrun. Anyone and everyone knows this. Unfortunately we have folks being played by the Establishment Globalist's/Socialist club and they keep on empowering them. Blinded today, but when it 180's on them , and they see the light, it's gonna be to late and past the point of return.
 
ChrisAMB said:
Where we disagree is using hyperbole to describe the situation. We aren’t being overrun. That’s nonsense.

Involving other nations in our immigration strategy means we partner with them to help solve the issues that send their citizens here in the first place. It doesn’t mean cutting them a blank check. Foreign aid is soft power and if we cede that to isolationism tendencies the Chinese will be in our backyard quickly. Most every proposal I’ve seen from the R side doesn’t address this at all and comically the R House attempted to strip a provision from the recent immigration bill that would expand pre-employment verification of eligibility.
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guessing you speak the facts and this is just the ones they admit to

Over 90% of US Population Growth Since 2020 Came From Hispanics​

 
Amazes me the folks who are defending, promoting and getting ready to vote for 2 , well announced 100% Socialist candidates. Those aren't my words, They came straight out of Kamala and The Tampon mans mouth.
I can't, Have not and Never will, compromise, find any common ground with Socialism or Marxism. Its non- negotiable.
 
Rain Cold said:
Why don't we make this simple? Can one of you lefties explain why open borders and unfettered migration/immigration is a good thing? And to make sure we're all on the same page, by unfettered I am not talking about the people go who through the legal, established process. I'm talking about the ones who sneak in and we don't know who they are.

And I'm taking the classic and false rebuttal of "But this is only a very rare occurrence and only accounts for 0.000000000000001% of people crossing the border" off the table.

And also, let's have none of the classic Russian whataboutism "But Trump blah blah blah....."

Can someone tell me why this is a good thing for our country? I'm seriously asking.
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I haven’t seen a single poster advocate for open borders. Despite what the cable news chyrons tell you you’d be hard pressed to find anyone in the real world that thinks that and isn’t trolling.

What this discussion is about is solving the acute issue or solving the actual problem. Walling off the border with land mines doesn’t solve the problem. When we help create the conditions in Central America that enable people to stay in their own countries then we’ll have solved the problem. Other issues such as Mexico looking the other way when international migrants show up can be solved by diplomacy and if needed financial incentive.
 
Bham 99 said:
That's interesting We have to consult with other countries regarding our border policies.
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Yes we actually have to do that. As long as there is commerce between two nations and legal ability to cross you simply make things worse by acting unilaterally. If there was a way to stop the people and allow the commercial traffic through I’m fairly certain it would have been implemented. Like everything else in the world it’s just not that simple.
 
ChrisAMB said:
The issue is by stating your opinion you attempt to speak for “the people.” Call it your opinion and leave it at that.

The topic of lowering the political temperature in the country comes up often and this is a good example. Declaring your political opponents in religious terms “evil” and attempting to frame them as “others” doesn’t help to bring people together to find common ground. It’s quite sad to me to see other people think they’re losing freedoms just because someone else now has the freedom to live as they choose. I’m more “free” to live as I choose than my father was at my age. Same for him and his father. I hope my children think the same in the future.
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I never said I spoke for you or anybody else on a personal level. We don't owe one another a thing. When I left for afghanistan that first deployment I left a very united country that had my back. When I retired in 2017 I no longer recognized the country I came back to despite my wifes warning. When did all this division start? You tell me because I wasn't here. I'm sorry but I look across the aisle on just this board alone and I see exactly what I speak of. I see very little common ground but that's life. I have the means to escape it if and when I so choose and I'm not going to wait around to watch what is happening to our great cities fester its way in to my neck of the woods too. Our country is going down the tubes and it's sad to watch.....my opinion of course
 
ChrisAMB said:
Yes we actually have to do that. As long as there is commerce between two nations and legal ability to cross you simply make things worse by acting unilaterally. If there was a way to stop the people and allow the commercial traffic through I’m fairly certain it would have been implemented. Like everything else in the world it’s just not that simple.
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Well your side has been in charge for almost 4 years and it's gotten a thousand times worse.
 
ChrisAMB said:
I haven’t seen a single poster advocate for open borders. Despite what the cable news chyrons tell you you’d be hard pressed to find anyone in the real world that thinks that and isn’t trolling.

What this discussion is about is solving the acute issue or solving the actual problem. Walling off the border with land mines doesn’t solve the problem. When we help create the conditions in Central America that enable people to stay in their own countries then we’ll have solved the problem. Other issues such as Mexico looking the other way when international migrants show up can be solved by diplomacy and if needed financial incentive.
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The border is WIDE OPEN as we speak and you don't seem to have any issues with it. What is that if it isn't advocating? Go see for yourself because you aint gonna see it through the lens of the media.
 
Sandbar said:
I never said I spoke for you or anybody else on a personal level. We don't owe one another a thing. When I left for afghanistan that first deployment I left a very united country that had my back. When I retired in 2017 I no longer recognized the country I came back to despite my wifes warning. When did all this division start? You tell me because I wasn't here. I'm sorry but I look across the aisle on just this board alone and I see exactly what I speak of. I see very little common ground but that's life. I have the means to escape it if and when I so choose and I'm not going to wait around to watch what is happening to our great cities fester its way in to my neck of the woods too. Our country is going down the tubes and it's sad to watch.....my opinion of course
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I think this country has always been divided, it’s just become more apparent with the evolution of smart phones and social media.
 
ChrisAMB said:
I haven’t seen a single poster advocate for open borders. Despite what the cable news chyrons tell you you’d be hard pressed to find anyone in the real world that thinks that and isn’t trolling.

What this discussion is about is solving the acute issue or solving the actual problem. Walling off the border with land mines doesn’t solve the problem. When we help create the conditions in Central America that enable people to stay in their own countries then we’ll have solved the problem. Other issues such as Mexico looking the other way when international migrants show up can be solved by diplomacy and if needed financial incentive.
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I don't think anyone on the right in here at least are saying "don't work with other countries at all in any way shape or form". But when you have a gunshot wound to the chest, you don't stand around and say, "Hmmmm, well, I believe that might could be avoided in the future if we just all sing kumbaya and work together for peace and harmony." You stop the bleeding and get your a$$ to the hospital.

We have people pouring in. This is terrible for the country. That isn't debatable. It's not mysterious. It's not a hard concept to grasp at all. Stop it as safely as you can as quick as you can. And then deal with the long term stuff.

Ok, next lib. Go.
 
Sandbar said:
I never said I spoke for you or anybody else on a personal level. We don't owe one another a thing. When I left for afghanistan that first deployment I left a very united country that had my back. When I retired in 2017 I no longer recognized the country I came back to despite my wifes warning. When did all this division start? You tell me because I wasn't here. I'm sorry but I look across the aisle on just this board alone and I see exactly what I speak of. I see very little common ground but that's life. I have the means to escape it if and when I so choose and I'm not going to wait around to watch what is happening to our great cities fester its way in to my neck of the woods too. Our country is going down the tubes and it's sad to watch.....my opinion of course
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Do you consider yourself an optimist by nature or a pessimist?

I’m nearing 40 and just don’t see this huge divide in the real world. Online spaces like social media aren’t a representation of real life at all so I ignore them. I worked in Washington for a time and did campaign work after and saw Rs and Ds work together every day. Each side has their wishes but in the end the majority understood compromise was inevitable. That’s still the case today.

Looking back in history I see a different set of problems than what we had in the 80s or 90s but not necessarily a worse set of problems. The meshing of the right wing of the Republican Party and the dying evangelical church does give me some concern only because I have a personal connection to Northern Ireland and know what religious tension mixed with politics can create. On my side of the political aisle I’ve seen the left wing become a bit more prominent during Obama’s terms but peter out a bit when Bernie Sanders failed in his bid to win the nomination. I see the D party adopting much more of the country club republican type as it’s mainstream these days and incorporating left ideas when they fit.
 
ChrisAMB said:
Yes we actually have to do that. As long as there is commerce between two nations and legal ability to cross you simply make things worse by acting unilaterally. If there was a way to stop the people and allow the commercial traffic through I’m fairly certain it would have been implemented. Like everything else in the world it’s just not that simple.
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It seems like it would be fairly simple. If other countries can do it, we should be able to as well. Try to rush the border in Russia and see what kind of response you get. Force them to the check points and only allow vetted immigrants. Install as many obstacles as possible. Live fire as a last resort. If you're not coming through the designated checkpoint, you are an invader and should be treated as an enemy. Stop all of this catch and release crap. It should be catch and send back and told you can never qualify to enter again.
 
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