GoDuke
Member
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You cannot say with a straight face that you actually believe that data. Its absolute garbage, and there is literally now way to quantify what we have in this country currently but estimate. You know it as well as I do.
The military on borders around the world seems to work just fine. I'm going to need you to explain that a little further, especially with the wall that was being constructed under the prior administration. You call our border with a government controlled by cartels peaceful? Even RFK went down there and said the damn thing needs to be closed. I could care less if its legal or not, but to say that there is potentially legal issues with protecting our own border is patently garbage. We make the damn rules.
Peaceful border with one of our best trade partners? Who cares? Free trade with Mexico is half the reason higher wages and jobs have left this country in the first place.
We are just going to have to agree to disagree. You clearly like the direction the country is currently going, that's fine. Say you're for socialism, open borders, low wages, endless wars.
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Two things:
I wonder what that chart would look like if you count after June 2023 until now.
And secondly, that number is probably much higher based on these numbers alone.
Border crossing encounters U.S. 1990-2023 | Statista
The number of illegal border crossings reached an all-time high in 2022, with over 2.2 million migrant encounters registered by the U.S. Border Patrol.
www.statista.com
Edit: for some reason it paywalled this graph the second time
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ghost1
Member
Apprehensions and expulsions have gone up 3x to 4x under the Biden Admin compared to Trump so from this chart it looks like they are doing better than all the previous presidentsTwo things:
I wonder what that chart would look like if you count after June 2023 until now.
And secondly, that number is probably much higher based on these numbers alone.
Border crossing encounters U.S. 1990-2023 | Statista
The number of illegal border crossings reached an all-time high in 2022, with over 2.2 million migrant encounters registered by the U.S. Border Patrol.
Edit: for some reason it paywalled this graph the second time
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I hope one of these bad guys coming across the border moves and next door to you while abusing and ruining your property & family. When you're a victim of crime complaining on the media begging for money to pay for a family funeral, then maybe you'll realize the error of your ways.
Classic Democrat tactics to take a chart and try to twist it into being another administration's fault. They starting pouring in as soon as they knew Biden was coming into office, an opportunity they know wouldn't be around long. They didn't come under Trump in these record numbers, because there was no catch and release. Chart doesn't even count the getaways.
LickWx
Member
“Relative to undocumented immigrants, US-born citizens are over 2 times more likely to be arrested for violent crimes, 2.5 times more likely to be arrested for drug crimes, and over 4 times more likely to be arrested for property crimes. ”
I’m against an unruly border but let’s be truthful when we discuss things. Horrible thing to say Shawn
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www.pnas.org
As the immigration continues, the numbers will flip.
LickWx
Member
Except this is a per capita study… not raw numbers . Per capita illegals do commit less crimes. Listen, don’t hate the migrants and demonize them. Hate the elected officials who were complacent on the issue.
LickWx
Member
Did the composition of migrants change ? What reason do you have to believe migrants post 2014 are more violent than pre?
It's actually 2020,. the URL tricked me.
Here are numbers I came across on the gov's websites:
ForsythSnow
Moderator
There's always so much back and forth about the people crossing the border and not enough thoughts to stop why. People are fleeing their nations because of how bad it is. Most immigrants aren't even Mexican, they're from South and Central America. Mexico doesn't want them either, but we can spend trillions to turn our borders and oceans into a modern day of the Berlin wall and we still will have millions of people flood in other ways. Do you put out a fire at the flames reaching the ceiling or at the source? We need to work with these nations or hold them accountable and work WITH Mexico to cut the immigration down since their border is much smaller.
As for the whole job debate, they typically fill jobs we don't want or if they were here in the US, they'd be criminally underpaid worse than an Amazon employee in the name of exponential profit. Sure it'd be easier to find a job but it's just like the "housing shortage" that isn't actually real, it's just a shortage of jobs that pay enough for what you need to put into them. Those same jobs are enough for people who are used to making the equivalent of 100 dollars a week or less too, which is why they're filled by these people. Take away all the immigrants and you don't have enough people to fill the jobs, and the economy really tanks because companies all stop making profits where they used them, especially in agriculture and manufacturing and now you have lost a lot of necessities.
We're at 4% unemployment. 4 million Americans cannot fill this gap. The rest don't want jobs or gave up so you can add maybe another 3 million at most. Even if the gap is met, do we really want to round up millions of people gestapo style and send them back up the river without a real solution? They're just going to come back since they don't want to be in their home country. The whole process creates extra desperation which is where criminal activity is born.
As for the whole job debate, they typically fill jobs we don't want or if they were here in the US, they'd be criminally underpaid worse than an Amazon employee in the name of exponential profit. Sure it'd be easier to find a job but it's just like the "housing shortage" that isn't actually real, it's just a shortage of jobs that pay enough for what you need to put into them. Those same jobs are enough for people who are used to making the equivalent of 100 dollars a week or less too, which is why they're filled by these people. Take away all the immigrants and you don't have enough people to fill the jobs, and the economy really tanks because companies all stop making profits where they used them, especially in agriculture and manufacturing and now you have lost a lot of necessities.
We're at 4% unemployment. 4 million Americans cannot fill this gap. The rest don't want jobs or gave up so you can add maybe another 3 million at most. Even if the gap is met, do we really want to round up millions of people gestapo style and send them back up the river without a real solution? They're just going to come back since they don't want to be in their home country. The whole process creates extra desperation which is where criminal activity is born.
NCSNOW
Member
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Once again out of context and you hop on it. The story came out yesterday that WOAT was not thrilled with the Waltz pick and that he wished he had not bowed out. That is what Orange Bad Man was addressing.
Yeah but when the influx goes up 4000%, it's a big net loss
Broken024
Member
You think ~10% of the population in this country is here illegally? Not every brown person you see is illegal.
I don't think there is a lot of understanding in forums like this about economics or the business cycle. The government through its fiscal and monetary policies and it's collusion with various industries has, over time, completely warped the economy.
All that aside, you can talk about low wage jobs, crime rates, illegal voting, and poor innocent people fleeing bad countries hoping for a better life until the cows come home. But the only thing that matters is YOU DO NOT HAVE A COUNTRY WOTHOUT BORDERS.
Whatever benefits unfettered immigration brings is vastly offset by the many negative impacts this will have over time. And when you see politicians allow this, while talking out of the other side of their mouth about wanting a better life for all Americans, then you know their actual intent is the destruction of the country.
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I guarantee you there are more than 300 million people in America.
Broken024
Member
Bet the real number is closer to 375 or more
I give you an A+ for a very well thought out and written argument however you are off base. The 4 million gap you speak of, 99 percent of that gap is for skilled positions. Close to 100k have been laid off in the tech sector alone in the last 3 months. That puts the number well over 300k for the tech sector this year alone. Companies are not spending money on capital projects. They are simply hoping to keep the lights on. There are not enough jobs open in any sector to close the gap you speak of and when the free money runs out guess what happens. We end up in a situation like Europe and Venezuela. You cannot print more money and expect it solves this problem because it doesn’t. This type of thinking only ends one way and it is bad.