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Coronavirus (Stay on Topic)

Yellow Snow

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This link has the actual plan Trump could have used, its a detailed step by step system, you can read every word and look at all the graphs and data they had, it is a good plan to use especially if there is not any other option other than winging it...if Trump and his team had followed it we would have been much better off....
Well, you can believe Politico's spin, or you can read the document yourself. For example, take note of the operational phases for an international emerging infectious disease threat: 2a (the PHEIC) didn't happen until Jan. 30th, and - as has been noted here many times - the US issued its own national PHE the very next day.

1585686752532.png
 

Yellow Snow

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Definitely don't disagree with the points outlined in the document, certainly would be beating a dead horse to reinforce them.

I'm honestly still very insulted someone just tried to tell me that I have no idea what I'm talking about and should familiarize myself the incident command system & emergency management, spare me....

As an important aside, I worked in the planning and homeland security branch (usually just referred to as planning) of the NC State Government's department of public safety and it was MY JOB for two years to recommend courses for other emergency managers to take so they could advance their career(s) in the department, so you could only imagine how much work I had to do, sifting through the hundreds of courses that were offered, understanding the skillset of literally every single emergency manager in all branches of emergency management and trying to fit courses that were not only applicable to their current job, but providing them ones that would advance them to "x" position.

Here's an example of a portion of the training I had to develop for all employees in the operations section. Training would change obviously for each position in the department.

View attachment 38161
Apologies if your tender feelings were hurt, but that means you of all people should know local & state emergency managers don't sit on their hands waiting for a POTUS to lead them by the nose.
 

EmersonGA

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Everything is hard to get locally right now. Tell your friend to look online. Johhnys seeds, victory or territorial are among a few I use
I save a bunch of seed so I should be able to help him out but those are good resources. Southeast Exposure Seed Company is a favorite of mine for what they do to help endangered Southern Apps seeds.
 

Webberweather53

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Apologies if your tender feelings were hurt, but that means you of all people should know local & state emergency managers don't sit on their hands waiting for a POTUS to lead them by the nose.
Are you done yet? I am probably the very last person you should be trying to talk down to on this forum about emergency management.

The president and his administration has the power to immediately begin deploying federal resources (in particular, FEMA) to assist in disaster response and recovery efforts when state resources are (or are going to be) exhausted even before local disaster declarations are declared, and this usually happens ya know when you have a regional or national crisis, of course CoV dwarfs any natural disaster we've ever seen in terms of national-scale impact so it's a pretty big deal to get support from the feds asap. Dropped the ball by several weeks in that regard.

Instead of acting, they sat on their hands and pointed fingers at the democratic party for overblowing the crisis when they weren't taking it seriously.

Effective emergency management response requires adequate strategic planning, regular exercises, (and then more planning and more exercises, this usually tends to go on for days, if not weeks at a time (for Matthew (2016) for ex planning and homeland security exercises went on for about 3 days or so on top of the exercises that are normally conducted every year for every type of disaster and plans are constantly being tweaked over the course of the entire year (which my department was obviously in charge of)), in addition to communication (arguably the most important one) and finally, competence, coherence at all levels of government, the last bit we clearly failed.
 
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Arcc

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The good news is the model has already cut total number of deaths in AL. You can look at it here. Also based on so far today, it probably drops again tomorrow.

 

Yellow Snow

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Are you done yet? I am probably the very last person you should be trying to talk down to on this forum about emergency management.

The president and his administration has the power to immediately begin deploying federal resources (in particular, FEMA) to assist in disaster response and recovery efforts when state resources are (or are going to be) exhausted even before local disaster declarations are declared, and this usually happens ya know when you have a regional or national crisis, of course CoV dwarfs any natural disaster we've ever seen in terms of national-scale impact so it's a pretty big deal to get support from the feds asap. Dropped the ball by several weeks in that regard.

Instead of acting, they sat on their hands and pointed fingers at the democratic party for overblowing the crisis when they weren't taking it seriously.

Effective emergency management response requires adequate strategic planning, regular exercises, (and then more planning and more exercises, this usually tends to go on for days, if not weeks at a time (for Matthew (2016) for ex planning and homeland security exercises went on for about 3 days or so on top of the exercises that are normally conducted every year for every type of disaster and plans are constantly being tweaked over the course of the entire year), in addition to communication (arguably the most important one) and finally, competence, coherence at all levels of government, the last bit we clearly failed.
And yet somehow many in the private sector made hard choices in January and early February without Trump having to spoon-feed them, by simply evaluating the available data themselves. Why couldn't Mayor Cantrell and Governor Edwards do the same?

 

ontherocks

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I save a bunch of seed so I should be able to help him out but those are good resources. Southeast Exposure Seed Company is a favorite of mine for what they do to help endangered Southern Apps seeds.
You mean Southern Exposure Seed Company, and yes, they are the best IMHO. Ira Wallace is a wealth of knowledge and her book Vegetable Gardening in the Southeast is a must have.
 

iGRXY

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SC has a new 1 day high of 158 cases and 4 additional deaths. We desperately need a shelter in place ordinance here. We broke the 1K mark today as well.
 

Webberweather53

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And yet somehow many in the private sector made hard choices in January and early February without Trump having to spoon-feed them, by simply evaluating the available data themselves. Why couldn't Mayor Cantrell and Governor Edwards do the same?

You wouldn't suppose that's because the state and local emergency management response when it's expected to become overburdened, is almost entirely exclusively dependent on the federal government? Speaking from my own first-hand experience, there's only so much planning you can do at a local and state level irrespective of entities like FEMA, if you don't have (or know) the proper (amount of) support (you'll generally receive (if at all)) from the feds right from the outset and as early as possible, it completely screws with preparedness efforts and throws a massive wrench in drills and exercises that are conducted every year and immediately preceding a disaster, communication (especially in the logistics and operations branch) is pivotal in the preceding stages to eradicate potential failure points, and this lack of preparedness unfortunately does trickle down from the feds all the way to state emergency management directors, the local area coordinators and even emergency operation centers.
 

Yellow Snow

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You wouldn't suppose that's because the state and local emergency management response when it's expected to become overburdened, is almost entirely exclusively dependent on the federal government? Speaking from my own first-hand experience, there's only so much planning you can do at a local and state level irrespective of entities like FEMA, if you don't have (or know) the proper (amount of) support (you'll generally receive (if at all)) from the feds right from the outset and as early as possible, it completely screws with preparedness efforts and throws a massive wrench in drills and exercises that are conducted every year and immediately preceding a disaster, communication (especially in the logistics and operations branch) is pivotal in the preceding stages to eradicate potential failure points, and this lack of preparedness unfortunately does trickle down from the feds all the way to state emergency management directors, the local area coordinators and even emergency operation centers.
Nothing was "overburdened" in early February - all the city government in NO had to do was issue a statement saying "We regret to announce that Mardi Gras events are cancelled this year". If that had been done, it's very possible NO wouldn't be dealing with twice the cases that metro Atlanta is dealing with right now.
 

Arcc

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Heard on the radio that UAB has 51 in the hospital for Covid. I actually think that is less than last week. I’m pretty sure it was in the 80s.
 

GeorgiaGirl

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Food shopping update...

Today was probably the best it's gone in the last couple weeks! Ground chicken was picked up, and it led to us having spaghetti and meatballs tonight, and that was pretty good, a chicken was picked up (that wasn't a rotisserie although that kind of chicken is good), veal was picked up and we're going to have a veal pot roast at some point, and we're going to have spare ribs. Those were the highlights.

Still no essentials like toilet paper or Clorox wipes, so while we might be settling in in ways, it's not totally normal. Dad getting that tip at the Dollar General that's under a mile away is likely our ticket to usually having toilet paper for a while.
 

Sandbar

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Then follow the rules so it isn't 400K plus ... if anyone is reading and comprehending ...
Great point. With the size of our country and the spread if this virus that seems like a horrific number but 100,000 - 200,000 isnt a crazy number for a country of 300 million. If they get NY under control and stop more NY from happening it will be a victory against this virus
 

Webberweather53

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Nothing was "overburdened" in early February - all the city government in NO had to do was issue a statement saying "We regret to announce that Mardi Gras events are cancelled this year". If that had been done, it's very possible NO wouldn't be dealing with twice the cases that metro Atlanta is dealing with right now.
:rolleyes: ugh, at no point did I say or imply the system was already overburdened in early February, in preparation for it to become overburdened federal resources should have already been deployed or in preparation to be deployed which they clearly weren't.

There's this thing called reading comprehension, I think you should give it a try.

Hey what do I know, I only spent 2 years in emergency management at the state level...
 

Yellow Snow

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:rolleyes: ugh, at no point did I say or imply the system was already overburdened in early February, in preparation for it to become overburdened federal resources should have already been deployed or in preparation to be deployed which they clearly weren't.

There's this thing called reading comprehension, I think you should give it a try.
My original post was making the observation that it was insane the officials in Louisiana didn't cancel Mardi Gras, even after the global PHEIC and the national PHE were declared in late January. Perhaps you didn't "comprehend" that point:
1585694296405.png
Hey what do I know, I only spent 2 years in emergency management at the state level...
Argument from authority fallacy? Sad!
 

Snow_chaser

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With the adjustments they made to the Georgia noon numbers, we will most likely pass 4000 confirmed cases when the 7:00 update is released. The updated noon numbers was 3929 cases and 111 deaths
 

Webberweather53

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My original post was making the observation that it was insane the officials in Louisiana didn't cancel Mardi Gras, even after the global PHEIC and the national PHE were declared in late January. Perhaps you didn't "comprehend" that point:
View attachment 38167


Argument from authority fallacy? Sad!
Don't forget about the part where you just put words in my mouth.

Hold up, you mean to tell me that with my two years of actual on-the-job experience, I can actually & rightfully say I probably know a lot more than you do about emergency management? What a revelation!

Oh, let's also not forget, you were the one that took it upon yourself and went completely out of your way to personally attack and lecture me about the incident command system.

You're adorable.
 

Downeastnc

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:rolleyes: ugh, at no point did I say or imply the system was already overburdened in early February, in preparation for it to become overburdened federal resources should have already been deployed or in preparation to be deployed which they clearly weren't.

There's this thing called reading comprehension, I think you should give it a try.

Hey what do I know, I only spent 2 years in emergency management at the state level...
Early Feb you say.....on Feb 5, HHS Secretary Azar requested $2 billion to buy respirator masks & other supplies for the national stockpile, Trump cut that request by 75%...…..

Going to be over 700 deaths in the US probably today, Italy has over 800, Spain 700.....over 4k deaths worldwide....and that's with a lot of the world on lockdown....its easy to see how something like the Spanish Flu was so bad 100 yrs ago.
 

Arcc

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Chart Dr. Birx just showed on the briefing is scary. 100-240k US deaths IF we all follow the rules. Oh my god
Listening to the press conference, they crawfished a lot on that number. If I heard right, that projection is based on several big metros becoming like NYC and both DRs said we could go considerbly below it. Interesting enough, it was actually Trump who stepped in and reliterated the 100k was the lowest count.
 

Webberweather53

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Early Feb you say.....on Feb 5, HHS Secretary Azar requested $2 billion to buy respirator masks & other supplies for the national stockpile, Trump cut that request by 75%...…..

Going to be over 700 deaths in the US probably today, Italy has over 800, Spain 700.....over 4k deaths worldwide....and that's with a lot of the world on lockdown....its easy to see how something like the Spanish Flu was so bad 100 yrs ago.
Big shocker! Could you imagine if we accepted his request and better yet, decided both from a health and business standpoint to ramp up domestic production of respirators, N95 masks, starting then, where we'd be? Sure hindsight is 20-20, but what would we have honestly lost by that juncture by "overreacting" to this "hoax"? Even in the unlikely scenario disease was not a very big deal in the US, we could reasonably give away, or better yet sell these products at an affordable rate to other nations around the globe who needed them asap in the weeks that immediately followed and it would have created more jobs and you could argue, momentarily buttress our economy for the downward slide that was inevitably going to come knocking given other economies (esp China) were in shambles.

Even if you're a cold-hearted, completely unfeeling big whig in business, you have to admit from that standpoint this was arguably one of the dumbest purely business decisions the administration could have made. Live and learn.
 
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Shaggy

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Big shocker! Could you imagine if we accepted his request and better yet, decided both from a health and business standpoint to ramp up domestic production of respirators, N95 masks, starting then, where we'd be? Sure hindsight is 20-20, but what would we have honestly lost by that juncture by "overreacting" to this "hoax"? Even in the unlikely scenario disease was not a very big deal in the US, we could reasonably give away, or better yet sell these products at an affordable rate to other nations around the globe who needed them asap in the weeks that immediately followed and it would have created more jobs and you could argue, momentarily buttress our economy for the downward slide that was inevitably going to come knocking given other economies (esp China) were in shambles.
Add accepting the WHO tests when offered we could gave been way ahead of this.
 

tazaroo

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Some of this is easy to see now. Hindsight is always 2020. President Trump had to go with the intelligence he was getting at the times. For instance, mid January the WHO said no human to human spread. Later Jan, Dr. Fauci said Americans in general don't need to worry about it.

Linkhttps://thehill.com/homenews/sunday-talk-shows/479939-government-health-agency-official-corona-virus-isnt-something-the

Also, President Trump was pretty distracted at the time. Remember the impeachment hearings. Immediately after that I do believe "some" Democrats, MSM were trying to use this politically whether they believed the virus was a problem or not, they could hurt Trump. Once the second week of March got here it became pretty obvious to all we have a problem. The degree is still debatable of course.

A lot of don't like President Trump in the first place while others of us do which makes us biased either way. I for one know President Trump isn't perfect. That's obvious! I do think he has done a pretty good job overall listening to his medical advisors and going with the info he had. Maybe a little slow. Just look at this board. All of us don't have all the same information he has and we all have different, sometimes quite passionate ideas, including myself.
 
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