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Misc All Things Religious

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Arcc said:
No one questions if the God if the Bible is an evil God because it doesn’t hold water at all.

I’ll ride with what Vernon McGee said in the predestination/free will issue, “Do I believe in predestination or free will? Yes”

I’m of the opinion that God wants us to question everything. As said in a Christian magazine, a person who doesn’t question anything or have any doubts, doesn’t really have faith. Doubts bring questions, which brings searching which brings answers which brings faith.
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A simple yes is not an answer... you have to support your argument. Vernon McGee clearly isn’t thinking or has no counter-argument.
 
Downeastnc said:
I don't wrestle with these questions....to me there are two different levels that I approached gods on, one is the physical science side and the other is the philosophical side....after along time of thinking things through these two levels I came to the conclusion that there is no god.....that was 25 yrs ago or so by now. I do enjoy these little debates though as it gives me perspective and in the end helps reinforce my beliefs.

Right now we are talking more on the philosophical side of things....you above points are noted but why not just pop up in front of everyone and declare yourself, declare yourself the one true god, ask everyone to repent and accept you and move on, hardly seems fair the make believing in you a prerequisite to everlasting salvation then not putting in a appearance as proof you exist.
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Jesus did this about 2,000 years ago, people doubted him then and nailed him to a cross.
 
EastAtlwx said:
I would like to hear some counter-arguments against the problem of pre-determinism vs free-will. Everything I’ve heard from Christians on this topic has been filled with confirmation bias towards their god is all-knowing & we don’t know anything so we shouldn’t question. This is a common tactic the Bible uses to deceive people into blind faith. & to add on top of that, no one in the Christian community ever questions that maybe the god depicted in the Bible is actually an evil god
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What specific problem are you referencing with these two views? Do you consider them to be exclusive, ie God either predestines OR man has free will but both cannot be true/compatible?
 
EastAtlwx said:
A simple yes is not an answer... you have to support your argument. Vernon McGee clearly isn’t thinking or has no counter-argument.
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No my argument and his as well is both can be true. Both are clearly noted as true in scripture. God can make a person and know the eventual outcome yet give us free will. How it all works, I don’t know and you can search and argue and hunt and you still won’t know.
 
If there is No God, then there is no eternal consuquence to living life like the devil so to speak. So why follow laws, try to live morally, be a good community citizen,husband,wife,father,mother, friend, co worker etc. Whats the point. A person only has 72.5 years on average. Heck beat the system, take all you can and live life for yourself, to the fullest . You dont have to please God if he doesnt exist. Why waste time pleasing other people,family members,friends. They are just bones walking around with flesh attached. Who cares what they think,feel. Once your dead thats it. You want be feeling anything,guilty, remorse. This is just nature.
If theres a God, then thats means we have a soul. How else could we even have a thing like a conscience? Lions,fish,apes,birds etc, they dont have a conscience? Wonder why human beings are the only thing on earth that has one? How did that happen?
 
I often ask a question if there is no God, we arent here by creation instead evolution. Why or how can anyone feel guilty if they lie,steal,cheat,murder,dont give love back to anyone else. How does evolution explain this?
 
NCSNOW said:
If there is No God, then there is no eternal consuquence to living life like the devil so to speak. So why follow laws, try to live morally, be a good community citizen,husband,wife,father,mother, friend, co worker etc. Whats the point. A person only has 72.5 years on average. Heck beat the system, take all you can and live life for yourself, to the fullest . You dont have to please God if he doesnt exist. Why waste time pleasing other people,family members,friends. They are just bones walking around with flesh attached. Who cares what they think,feel. Once your dead thats it. You want be feeling anything,guilty, remorse. This is just nature.
If theres a God, then thats means we have a soul. How else could we even have a thing like a conscience? Lions,fish,apes,birds etc, they dont have a conscience? Wonder why human beings are the only thing on earth that has one? How did that happen?
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Because life is what you make of it....simple as that. I don't need to fear punishment from a god to do the right thing or live a good life. I please people because it makes me feel good and it again is the right thing to do.

I would argue that man is not the only creatures on earth with a "conscience" there is a lot of science that suggest otherwise, they may not have it to the level we do but they are self aware and experience feelings...
 
Arcc said:
No my argument and his as well is both can be true. Both are clearly noted as true in scripture. God can make a person and know the eventual outcome yet give us free will. How it all works, I don’t know and you can search and argue and hunt and you still won’t know.
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There’s the confirmation bias... can’t use scripture as your evidence when I don’t consider it as an accurate source.
 
NCSNOW said:
You dont go to hell because you are murder,drunkard, thief,, hypocrite fill in the blank.
A person goes to hell because they dont have a relationship with Jesus Christ,[arent saved lost]. Thats the Bible,not me.
Heres some food for thought.
If God created this World, you beleive in creation. Doesnt it make sense he would supply a book,manuual so to speak expressing why ,how,what,where and whats to come? You guys check it out, I pray you find the truth and im more than willing to answer any questions anyone has.
One of the biggest atheist of modern time, a guy from Yale named Lee Strobel actually authored a book, turned into a motion picture "The case for Christ."
We have so desensitized God and who he really is in todays society. Hes not santa claus or the easter bunny. Hes real. The fact everyone on here recognizes todays date as 2020 ought to be telling. Its 2020 years after the death of a man named Jesus Christ. His life here on earth is the most significant event in the history of the world. You have to ask yourself why is that?
Remember folks God gives all of us the freedom to choose him,or reject him. Its your decession and you alone are solely responsible for it. Everyone will have eternal life. We will spend it eitheir in Heaven or Hell (thats the Bible/ Not NCSnow, some denominational church theology).
You werent created to just spend 72.5 average years here on earth and then thats it, all she wrote? Think about that. The world tells you,you evolved from a monkey after some massive explosion billions of years ago. And over time you just happened to reside in a place where there is a perfect balance of atmospheric gasses,developed these great communication skills and the reward is you live about 72.5 years and then they burry you. So live it up while your here,you can cause thats all there is. How depressing.
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Exactly right
 
NCSNOW said:
I often ask a question if there is no God, we arent here by creation instead evolution. Why or how can anyone feel guilty if they lie,steal,cheat,murder,dont give love back to anyone else. How does evolution explain this?
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I believe in the Big Guy. However, I also believe that a man could and should easily feel guilty for especially murdering someone because of common decency and common sense. Why would they need to believe in the Almighty to feel that it is wrong to murder a fellow human being? That view is downright shocking to be honest. Is that truly how you feel? Seriously?
 
EastAtlwx said:
There’s the confirmation bias... can’t use scripture as your evidence when I don’t consider it as an accurate source.
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I don't understand what you are driving at. You want a person to explain what God says in Scripture about free will vs predestination without using Scripture because you don't consider Scripture accurate. I would argue that you are displaying confirmation bias by saying you refuse to accept Scripture as accurate because it aligns with your belief that Scripture is flawed. I would also add that the "confirmation bias" argument is an exceedingly poor one to use. I would rather develop an argument on various assertions from Scripture and go from there vs a weak heuristic process like confirmation bias. Highlighted in bold below is what I would argue has happened with you viewing Scripture as an inaccurate source of data.

"Confirmation bias is one of the less-helpful heuristics which exists as a result. The information that we interpret is influenced by existing beliefs, meaning we are more likely to recall it. As a consequence, we tend to see more evidence that enforces our worldview. Confirmatory data is taken seriously, while disconfirming data is treated with skepticism. Our general assimilation of information is subject to deep bias." Source
 
GaWx said:
I believe in the Big Guy. However, I also believe that a man could and should easily feel guilty for especially murdering someone because of common decency and common sense. Why would they need to believe in the Almighty to feel that it is wrong to murder a fellow human being? That view is downright shocking to be honest. Is that truly how you feel? Seriously?
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Why is it that many people have seemingly contradicting views on murder, for example? Some seem to enjoy it (serial killers) and others show no remorse for their actions. Why don't these people have the same "decency" and common sense that others who believe it is wrong do? Are some humans simply better than others and morally superior? What if one culture deems murder perfectly acceptable and another says it is wrong, which culture is right and on what basis are they right if the Bible and the moral law it establishes is disregarded?
 
EastAtlwx said:
I would like to hear some counter-arguments against the problem of pre-determinism vs free-will. Everything I’ve heard from Christians on this topic has been filled with confirmation bias towards their god is all-knowing & we don’t know anything so we shouldn’t question. This is a common tactic the Bible uses to deceive people into blind faith. & to add on top of that, no one in the Christian community ever questions that maybe the god depicted in the Bible is actually an evil god
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Sounds to me like you think you found a chink in the armor of Christianity? LOL...Nothing like trying to make your enemy fight among themselves! With all the evidence we have to support the Bible and the Truths of the Bible, It takes more BLIND Faith to be a spiritualist.....give me a break!
 
snowlover91 said:
Why is it that many people have seemingly contradicting views on murder, for example? Some seem to enjoy it (serial killers) and others show no remorse for their actions. Why don't these people have the same "decency" and common sense that others who believe it is wrong do? Are some humans simply better than others and morally superior? What if one culture deems murder perfectly acceptable and another says it is wrong, which culture is right and on what basis are they right if the Bible and the moral law it establishes is disregarded?
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I agree. If you believe murder is wrong and doing good to your fellow man is right that is good. That said at least in this nation and most of Europe that view came from a Judeo/Christian background somewhere in the past. So to say you didn’t need God to show you that may not be exactly true.
 
Arcc said:
Then you have no argument. No sense in arguing something out of a book you can’t cite.
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Yep, it's logically contradictory to say "explain to me why this book says this but don't use the book that contains the quote to answer the question." That would be like asking someone to explain what Shakespeare means in a certain statement but then giving them the stipulation that you can't use anything he wrote because you don't consider it accurate or reliable. It's utter nonsense.
 
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