• Hello, please take a minute to check out our awesome content, contributed by the wonderful members of our community. We hope you'll add your own thoughts and opinions by making a free account!

Political Thread

Status
Not open for further replies.
k0skinne said:
I am not a regular reader of Christianity Today, but did find their editorial interesting. As a Christian and a conservative, voting for Trump was one of those things that I had to hold my nose and do, hopeful that the policies and appointments would back more or less what I believe makes for good, conservative government. The magazine made its point to compare with Clinton. Lest anyone forget, Clinton had major moral issues when he was elected into office as well, and I do not know if they had any editorials had against Clinton prior to his being elected, but it sounded as it didn't.

With all of that being said ... I am simply tired of the entire political scene ... I even avoid this thread and probably should not have even started reading today lol. While we will always have political disagreements, it seems that the days are long past where we can honorably compromise and work together on issues. There are extremes on both sides of the aisle, but I truly believe that the vast majority of Americans would be just a little right of center politically if they were quizzed. Unfortunately the extremes seem to be making the most noise.

As a conservative Christian, it seems that many of us have sold our souls so to speak on the Trump train, basically because of what the repercussions would be of voting for the other candidate. The editorial put into words a good bit about how I feel on the subject. I want our President, whomever it is, to be above reproach ... not perfect, but to stay above the fray. That does not mean that sometimes the President shouldn't fight, but I think it does mean that you don't lower yourself down to get into messes. One of the greatest signs of strength is to be able to admit that you are wrong about something. Trump simply cannot do that, on any issue, and that bothers me.

Whether or not, Trump is guilty with the Ukraine deal - though to me no matter how I look at it he is - just because others may have done the same type of thing previously doesn't give Trump the right to do it. Yes, it is true that the Democrats have been out to get him since Day 1. Yes it is true that there are a lot of corrupt Democrats after Trump. Yes, it is true that you cannot trust much of the reporting that is coming through the news media. Yes, someone needs to take Twitter away from Trump. Yes, the whole thing is simply a mess. I am tired of it and I don't have an answer for it.

Some of you may not be people of faith (and I respect that), but I believe that God ordains our leaders ... and God can use any of these leaders, regardless of political affiliation, to achieve His will. He has a purpose for Trump being President, and I am not God lol!

Sorry for rambling ... just ready to move on from all of this mess - kind of burned out over the whole thing. For those of you who are believers, we need to pray. Pray for our country, pray for all of its leaders, and pray that we can somehow get out of all this mess and focus on what I believe that the majority of Americans want ... a strong economy, strong defense, and opportunities for all our citizens to be successful. Regardless of our issues, this is still the greatest country in the world!

Merry Christmas to all!
Click to expand...
With that I think we can shut this thread down. :cool: Good post
 
ForsythSnow said:
You really think we will see a roaring 20s (only saying this because the next decade is the 2020s) repeat where people think a recession isn't going to happen and then we crash? I'd rather crash sooner than later so we don't hit the ground harder. Recessions are cyclical. It's like saying it'll never be winter again. You have so long without it you question if it'll ever come back, then it hits you hard one year and you're unprepared.
Click to expand...

No, I expect the economy will stay in the 2-4% range and when it drops below that the FED will inject cash and artificially keep things above recessions. Future times may feel like recessions but not meet the definition due to government influence. That said it will crash one day and that crash will be epic, but until then I believe it will be hard to have recessions in the past sense.
 
Shaggy said:
Which makes many of the claims questionable without independant research.
Click to expand...

Many of them can be quickly checked, as a person who follows the stock market I can tell you for sure the ones below are in fact accurate. I don't have time to or care to go through the entire list, but focusing on the economy you can click the links below for independent verification of the claims. Some of these are well known fact while others I've added some links for further reading.

Here's a nifty chart showing it the jobless rates from CNBC.

1576863630062.png
 
snowlover91 said:
Many of them can be quickly checked, as a person who follows the stock market I can tell you for sure the ones below are in fact accurate. I don't have time to or care to go through the entire list, but focusing on the economy you can click the links below for independent verification of the claims. Some of these are well known fact while others I've added some links for further reading.

Here's a nifty chart showing it the jobless rates from CNBC.

View attachment 28645
Click to expand...
Let's see how many of these things are or aren't directly tied to Trump's actions:
1. The economy took a slight boost due to cutting taxes on the rich and companies, allowing them to spend more even if the spending ins't on the employees, any spending and money movement will increase economic health. Trump here can take this to some degree even if most people don't see the money in their paychecks. I can say some I know have yet to see any.

2. Factor of the economy, but also because cost of living increases have driven more to get jobs. A good economy has that as a downside, but that's just economics. Other factors include the economic cycle, education, etc. Trump can only partially take this because economic cycles are a thing and population increases over time can help shrink statistics. He can't take all credit though.

3. Again factoring the economy. Almost the same as the last point. Education and job growth are owed to this. Also the force of laborers protesting low wages such as the teacher strikes and just general low unemployment means companies have to pay more to keep people since people can just go anywhere they want if they aren't paying well enough. Trump again can take some credit with the rest going to the cycle.

4. Education again and history. Trump hasn't done much for education as far as I have heard so him trying to make this his "doing" isn't valid. It also has more to do with small players and some companies trying to diversify their workforce.

5. Refer to the last point. Trump can't claim this either.

6. Refer to 4 again. Why is he even trying to claim this? It has nothing to do with his own actions.

7. Divorces, more independent women, an increase in feminism, more educated women, all social changes combined with an increased need for jobs due to a better economy helped make women more of the workforce than ever before. Trump can take the economic part but nothing else.

8. Uh yeah of course it has because people like me have to work and go to school to avoid the crushing student debt that has embraced the early Millennials. Also has to do with parents not wanting their kids living at home forever. Sorry Trump but you can't have this one. It's all social changes and shifts in the labor of who works what. It's either retail, restaurant, or some other low labor job unless you're a college student not looking for a job. Then you're not counted. This also raises another point. You're only counted as unemployed if you are looking. If you aren't you aren't counted. Keep this in mind.

9. Refer to prior about parents and social changes. I can't really explain this other than maybe those people are working low-non-long term jobs that the boost helped create. Only the economy boost goes to Trump. You can see where I'm going with this...

10. Policies lifting bans and such helped with this. Fracking, which is something I absolutely despise, has increased. This effects actual people and destroys the land and increases quake activity like in OK. Trump can have this greasy badge.

11. Just a GW point. We know Trump denies all climate change. Given that he isn't very environmentally friendly, he makes any attempt to reduce pollution look like evil. Whether it would really kill jobs is debatable. Not giving this a good victory to him myself. Take it how you want.

12. So? Government waste. Next.

13. Court packing at its finest. Again, take it how you want.

14. Steel is choking at the moment so the purpose of trying to save jobs is being lost. For national security? I'm laughing. I know China is a threat but what's the steel going to do? Hack us? He used the wrong wording. Still a loss if steel is suffering.

15. I can say this actually as a good thing that he did. China is a threat with cyber attacks. We don't need that in our country.

TLDR, Trump is trying to take trophies for stuff he barely had an influence in.
 
I'm not even gonna read all of the tldr post but one thing that does tend to gripe me is the "cutting taxes on the rich" left talking point. I received a tax cut/benefit and am nowhere near rich, as did many others. Cooperate tax breaks are necessary for job creation and of course it's only fair to say Obama gets credit for all the good stuff now because he blamed Bush for 7 of his 8 years in office so.... Funny I had no idea presidencies were like MJO's with such lengthy lag times

Wait.... wait wait wait, so all of the good economy stuff is directly the result of Obama and Trump can't and shouldn't take any credit but yet most of it not all of the same people claim Trump has ruined this country with his policies??? How in the name of all that makes sense can you have it both ways?
 
metwannabe said:
I'm not even gonna read all of the tldr post but one thing that does tend to gripe me is the "cutting taxes on the rich" left talking point. I received a tax cut/benefit and am nowhere near rich, as did many others. Cooperate tax breaks are necessary for job creation and of course it's only fair to say Obama gets credit for all the good stuff now because he blamed Bush for 7 of his 8 years in office so.... Funny I had no idea presidencies were like MJO's with such lengthy lag times

Wait.... wait wait wait, so all of the good economy stuff is directly the result of Obama and Trump can't and shouldn't take any credit but yet most of it not all of the same people claim Trump has ruined this country with his policies??? How in the name of all that makes sense can you have it both ways?
Click to expand...
Not everyone received money from the tax cut, you and some others did. What I was getting at was that Trump can take some credit, but neither can Obama for what he did. It's congress and the economic cycle that presidents try so hard to fool people into believing was all their doing.
 
metwannabe said:
I'm not even gonna read all of the tldr post but one thing that does tend to gripe me is the "cutting taxes on the rich" left talking point. I received a tax cut/benefit and am nowhere near rich, as did many others. Cooperate tax breaks are necessary for job creation and of course it's only fair to say Obama gets credit for all the good stuff now because he blamed Bush for 7 of his 8 years in office so.... Funny I had no idea presidencies were like MJO's with such lengthy lag times

Wait.... wait wait wait, so all of the good economy stuff is directly the result of Obama and Trump can't and shouldn't take any credit but yet most of it not all of the same people claim Trump has ruined this country with his policies??? How in the name of all that makes sense can you have it both ways?
Click to expand...

Yeah the whole tax cutting only helping the rich is as dumb and farfetched as some of the fringe wins Trump claims. True, I didn't see any difference in my paycheck, but I sure saw it in my refund.
 
ForsythSnow said:
Not everyone received money from the tax cut, you and some others did. What I was getting at was that Trump can take some credit, but neither can Obama for what he did. It's congress and the economic cycle that presidents try so hard to fool people into believing was all their doing.
Click to expand...

The President sets the tone on policy. Congress sends the package to him to sign or veto with a heavy emphasis on veto if it's not close to what he wants. Its only when the House and Senate are controlled by a single party that the advantage goes to them.....I bet you 100 dollars to a doughnut that if things tank Trump gets blamed 100%. Wanna take that bet? So yeah he gets credit for our boom times
 
Sandbar said:
The President sets the tone on policy. Congress sends the package to him to sign or veto with a heavy emphasis on veto if it's not close to what he wants. Its only when the House and Senate are controlled by a single party that the advantage goes to them.....I bet you 100 dollars to a doughnut that if things tank Trump gets blamed 100%. Wanna take that bet? So yeah he gets credit for our boom times
Click to expand...

How about consumer cost hitting decades long highs? He get credit for that too. Those increases pretty much are away the tax cuts for middle classers.
 
Sandbar said:
The country is rolling under Trump and its eating you alive! Its more than obvious......
Click to expand...

Lol its not eating anything but bandwidth as social media and the internet are ablaze with this presidency.

Trumps an unethical, unfit and disastrous leader the fact you dont care as long as people have meltdowns is your issue not mine. To each his own.
 
Shaggy said:
How about consumer cost hitting decades long highs? He get credit for that too. Those increases pretty much are away the tax cuts for middle classers.
Click to expand...

Huh? Looks like pretty much normal to me.
 

Attachments

  • US-CPI-2018-04-all-items.png
    US-CPI-2018-04-all-items.png
    22.1 KB · Views: 4
Arcc said:
Really the only thing I've seen really rise is certain metal products such as roofing tin due to the tariffs.
Click to expand...

I went back and rechecked the article and it was outdated from June 3rd as trump was gearing up more tariffs and how much those tariffs would have cost the average family.......2k+ versus the average tax cut of $931 dollars.

As we know those tariffs were placed on hold making the article invalid. My apologies. Need to remember to check the dates better.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top