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Misc General Banter Thread

ChrisAMB said:
What on earth is "leftist" about observing this NWS area of responsibility had more staffing shortages than normal? It's a conversation that must be had if warnings were late/not received. Let me put it this way: I work in insurance and as of late risk scoring is being reviewed across the country in response to this very thing. I can guarantee you the casualty underwriting for these areas detailed exactly what their plans were to be in the event of a flood event. NOAA weather radios, sirens, etc. If the warnings came down and weren't relayed there were issues with staff potentially not following procedures which while terrible can be rectified. If the warnings were late/not communicated via proper channels (IE-using social media) then we have an example of systemic risk.

My understanding is NOAA has been forcibly relocating some staff to areas of most critical need. This can backfill most of the time but you still lose local knowledge. In the same vein just because you don't see things "falling apart" from the outside doesn't mean there isn't institutional friction being introduced every day.
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25+ children are dead because the river rose 26 feet in 45 minutes. To blame this on a 10-22% staff shortage, or even mentioning within 24 hours is pure political excrement, but it’s par for the course.
 
J.C. said:
25+ children are dead because the river rose 26 feet in 45 minutes. To blame this on a 10-22% staff shortage, or even mentioning within 24 hours is pure political excrement, but it’s par for the course.
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The current conditions the camp leaders were witnessing should have mobilized them to safer areas. They waited way too long IMO.
 
Avalanche said:
The current conditions the camp leaders were witnessing should have mobilized them to safer areas. They waited way too long IMO.
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I don’t know the terrain there, but I would imagine it’s quite hilly, and for 6-8 inches of rain to cause a river to rise the much that quickly, that had to be a large surface area draining into one river. For some reason there was a camp there.
 
J.C. said:
I don’t know the terrain there, but I would imagine it’s quite hilly, and for 6-8 inches of rain to cause a river to rise the much that quickly, that had to be a large surface area draining into one river. For some reason there was a camp there.
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Crazy it's been there for 100 years too

There's a lot I don't understand about this story yet but let's be clear they had plenty of warnings

Also I don't know for sure down there but we ain't that far away up here and it's been insanely wet for months. San Antonio also had a deadly flood just a few weeks ago during the rush hour. 13 people dead in their cars
 
Brent said:


😲 when it rises that fast theres not much you can do
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One of my cardinal rules; we will never stay in a place where flash floods like that are possible and never will my kids go to where it could happen.

I remember being in Buck's Pocket State Park and watching the creek there go from bone dry to three or four feet above flood stage in five minutes. Stuff nightmares are made of.
 
Arcc said:
One of my cardinal rules; we will never stay in a place where flash floods like that are possible and never will my kids go to where it could happen.

I remember being in Buck's Pocket State Park and watching the creek there go from bone dry to three or four feet above flood stage in five minutes. Stuff nightmares are made of.
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Sadly these folks didn’t have the chance to learn and live. Those that did survive will never allow this to happen again. I’m really sad for the loved ones of those that lost their lives. Seems so unavoidable, and likely is, but that kind of quick flooding these kids have likely never seen so it probably seems impossible to ever happen in their minds.
 
Arcc said:
One of my cardinal rules; we will never stay in a place where flash floods like that are possible and never will my kids go to where it could happen.

I remember being in Buck's Pocket State Park and watching the creek there go from bone dry to three or four feet above flood stage in five minutes. Stuff nightmares are made of.
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There's a couple in western NC that are a tragedy waiting to happen.

Having caught up this evening on the events, there are a lot of questions needing answers from the county government in that part of TX. NWS issued warnings specifically referencing river camps hours before the flood. Neighboring counties received push notifications via reverse 911 and mobile networks, but not Kerr County where the camp was. This is apparently a very well-to-do county with some very highly paid county executives that need to answer why they had no siren system like neighboring counties and relied on a Facebook page to get evacuation alerts out.

The pictures from the Camp today show all the buildings seemingly intact and one or two fences knocked over. Very high water marks certainly, but not destruction. What a sad and probably preventable tragedy.
 
This picture is from the New York Times today of Camp Mystic. Obvious signs of flooding but I would have expected more structure damage. There's a tributary creek that overflowed the 1 road going to the campground and by accounts of people from there they were basically trapped on the floodplain. Very sad.

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Yeah one thing I'm also confused about is the reports that the youngest kids were closest to the river. How does that make sense?

The other camps were fine for the most part. All the missing is the youngest

But yeah there's so many unanswered questions still. The camp director died and she's been there for 45 years. 45 years and dead just like that
 
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ChrisAMB said:
We have ponds that have been nearly dry since the spring of 2021 aside from a week-ish after tropical system flooding. The water table had gotten so low they wouldn't even fill up after heavy rains. Now we're looking at possibly our third straight month of doubling our average rainfall and they're finally coming up.
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Just wanted to add I’ve seen this as well. As a teenager in Cary we had a creek that always flowed. It had fish, frogs, turtles, tadpoles, crawdads you name it. In the early 2000’s it began to dry up and it has no water and no life now.

Another one outside of Pittsboro same thing. Always flowed from my Grandfather’s generation 1920’s all the way through the 2010’s. It’s now dry with no life, on the rare floods it will have flowing water then dry again. No fish, crawdads, turtles, all signs of life gone
 
I am guessing the older kids were further away to keep them from meeting boys from near by camps. I have been trapped by flooding twice. Once during Camille in 69 and at my neighborhood pool when my son was 8. How fast water can rise in a matter of minutes is terrifying .We were camping on Anastasia Island in 69. High tide was higher from the storm and cut off the island. The highest point on the island was the rec center. Ironically it was near the beach. We did not get a direct hit , but the water was just a few feet away all around the building. As I watched the trash cans float bye , I was not sure I would make it to 13. We were at a pool birthday party when my son was 8. The pool must have been made in what was a small quarry. You walked in next to a 2 story building that had changing rooms on bottom and a covered deck with a roof. The deck was also ground level since it was a bowl. Sunny one minute and pouring the second. We got all the kids up on the deck to wait for it to pass. To our horror by the time we had the kids all up , down below looked like a bowl of water. We had to hand the kids over the fence that was behind the deck. 30 minutes later it was sunny. I don't know how much rain they had at the camp. It was the rain that hit up river and caused a dam to break that cause the rapid rise. I hope they have alerts put in. I know place have sirens to alert when they release water at dams. With technology they could have them alternate sound with the word flood , fire, or tornado. Hopefully some good can be found in seeing and fixing places that need more warning equipment. Those poor babies😔
 
Up to 69 dead already and still a bunch missing

I suspect there will be people never found... Probably too far downstream by now
 
This whole no warning thing grinds my grits. Every year we have situations where storms suddenly and unexpectedly train over an area and cause flash floods. I mean it happens in Birmingham at least once per year. Any EMA/official with sense in an already flood prone area should know this.
 
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