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Ukraine

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Im not implying here a point of no return as far as a world war is concerned. I doubt very much this goes beyond Ukraine. But we are headed toward a point where alot of economic damage is going to be done to alot of countries. Why not make a reasonable offer to Putin? Agree to a ceasefire, sit down and talk, and all sanctions will be dropped.
 
Shaggy said:
Who are we as a nation if we don't offer meaningful military support to an innocent nation being attacked for no reason? The entire world should be coming down on Russia
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I understand your feelings completely, but I don't think anyone can make a good debate for a police action considering the utter failures they have been since Vietnam. I think it's a very low rate, like 0 percent? I think when we talk about physically using our military force we have to realize that when our intention is to stop the bad guys, the bad guys will view it as an act of war. If they declare war on us, would we not have to declare war on them? I'm not saying that would be wrong, but if we get into this, we have to be willing to utterly destroy Russia as we know it. Be willing to kill all the population that supports their government. The real problem with Russia isn't Ukraine, It is the whole of Russia. Who they are. That is the only way you ever succeed at war. Otherwise, we just go sacrifice some boys and girls to say "we tried".
 
metwannabe said:
Lord I hope he is wrong

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I have been having similar thoughts the past few days. Knowing how Putin is. He very much so has that Alpha mindset. I have been trying to visualize what an off ramp might look like for him. Obviously that off ramp would have been traversed more easily and looked more appealing had he taken it earlier on in this campaign. However now there is no way possible he can do so and save face for him and his nation. Even if he pulls out now the damage is done he has seemingly cutoff Russia from the rest of the civilized world for the foreseeable future. He has completely setback relations with his nation and the west to where they were during the cold War under the Soviet Union. It had taken them decades to get to a position where they had gained a fair amount of respect. It wasn't perfect but it was better than what it had been. That's all been wiped away now. So it really makes you wonder how fat will he go knowing that.
 
Cold Miser said:
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I do wonder if the isolation could be causing Putin to lose some sanity. He’s apparently a maniac about covid and won’t let anyone near him. Just look at those insane photos from the meetings with 50 ft long tables, and that “meeting” where they decided to recognize the breakaway provinces where Putin was calling up the advisors/ministers like they were presenting a book report a good 100 ft distant from him. Anyone that is allowed close to him has to undergo an insane quarantine procedure. It’s bizarre and has kept him very isolated these last couple years, and makes you wonder why he is paranoid…a potential comorbidity like the rumors suggest? Who knows. Maybe he’s just crazy.
 
VegasEagle said:
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Yikes, that’s looking really bad for Ukraine in the east. I think things are getting to then point where they’re going to need to withdraw their troops to the west of the Dniepier soon. Or else they’re going to lose a significant number of troops to encirclement.
 
superjames1992 said:
I do wonder if the isolation could be causing Putin to lose some sanity. He’s apparently a maniac about covid and won’t let anyone near him. Just look at those insane photos from the meetings with 50 ft long tables, and that “meeting” where they decided to recognize the breakaway provinces where Putin was calling up the advisors/ministers like they were presenting a book report a good 100 ft distant from him. Anyone that is allowed close to him has to undergo an insane quarantine procedure. It’s bizarre and has kept him very isolated these last couple years, and makes you wonder why he is paranoid…a potential comorbidity like the rumors suggest? Who knows. Maybe he’s just crazy.
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I am not happy about those photos from the meetings with 50 ft long table. Makes it harder to put a bullet in his head.
 
Rubio is speaking real ville language. No way sensationilizing. Very serious times.

Also on NCweather map. If Russia gets the capital, that river is next. Then they will backfill all that open countryside back east , carving out the whole eastern half of Ukraine. Clear to see what the strategy was. Problem is he needed it quick. Then he can march west up to the polish border before Nato got a sense of urgency.
 
NCSNOW said:
But China. Never underestimate their ability to backdoor and prop em up. China wants nothing more than to use its new Digi coin to replace Dollar. Has plenty customers in Asia.
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As Russian society crumbles under a collapsing ruble, and basic modern comforts China will be watching. Russia is ruined already and not a single shot has been fired by anyone but the Ukranians.
 
NCSNOW said:
Rubio is speaking real ville language. No way sensationilizing. Very serious times.

Also on NCweather map. If Russia gets the capital, that river is next. Then they will backfill all that open countryside back east , carving out the whole eastern half of Ukraine.
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Is it realville? Is he making things worse?
 
In looking at that map, understanding is ~7-10K Russian Marines have not landed from the Black Sea, 1 landing of ~2K (USMC MEU) occurred in the Sea of Azov. Black Sea landing will be a division'ish, Russia's premier amphibious landing capability. As a US Marine, amphibious landings are extremely difficult, MEU levels, weather will not be in their favor.

USMC MEU Hardware, ~2200 Marines

en.wikipedia.org

Marine expeditionary unit - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

usmc.PNG
 
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Storm5 said:
He's on the intelligence committee. He knows way more than we do


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Yes, and does he need to share it all over twitter? I might be the only one here who thinks this way but i dont care for politicians like him who seem to be cheerleading for war. Alot of people who knew more than we do got us into an invasion of Iraq with thousands of Americans dead and maimed, and for a false premise as it turns out. Its no point in me pursuing this further since i dont want to get banned.
 
lexxnchloe said:
Yes, and does he need to share it all over twitter? I might be the only one here who thinks this way but i dont care for politicians like him who seem to be cheerleading for war. Alot of people who knew more than we do got us into an invasion of Iraq with thousands of Americans dead and maimed, and for a false premise as it turns out. Its no point in me pursuing this further since i dont want to get banned.
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Everyone is free to share their opinion . This thread is tricky cause is it almost has to invoke politics . With that said I've been following his tweets since the invasion started and I don't see any cheerleading . Everything he's said has come true . But I could be wrong . I totally respect your opinion


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Thor said:
Seems like a lot of misinformation going around. The main one I have heard is that Putin is somehow sick, mentally or physically. But who does that potentially benefit? It absolutely benefits Russia in helping keep the west/Nato at bay thinking he just may be "unwell" enough to hit the button. Don't believe a thing I read at face value these days.
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Let me play the devils advocate to that. I think a premise that Putin is unstable would get the West’s attention even more, and would likely become a catalyst for intervention whereas they normally wouldn’t.
 
BlueRidgeFolklore said:
Let me play the devils advocate to that. I think a premise that Putin is unstable would get the West’s attention even more, and would likely become a catalyst for intervention whereas they normally wouldn’t.
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There is alot of half-truths and false info percolating in the media. Putin miscalculated and blew it. lets not be stampeded into unwise decisions based on media reports. The media has its own agenda and months from now, or years from now, we may wish cooler heads had prevailed.
 
Air supremacy is several days away from being determined. NATO at this stage could lock it down <24hrs.
 
WeatherNC said:
Air supremacy is several days away from being determined. NATO at this stage could lock it down <24hrs.
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You realize what you are suggesting right? If NATO formally gets involved it is likely to become a far different war. You ready for that?
 
Storm5 said:
He's on the intelligence committee. He knows way more than we do


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You don’t have to be on an Intelligence Committee to see it. We talked about the point of no return a couple days ago, where Putin was at a place where even if he did withdraw, the sanctions and war crime charges would be too much for Russia to overcome anytime soon, and that he was more likely to ramp up the intensity than withdraw. Fast forward 2 days and Russia is well on their way to short term economic collapse, Putin is embarrassed, Russia is embarrassed, and the world is quickly losing respect for what was previously thought of as a world power. Rubio is simply alluding to a “bully’s” tendency to make a big splash in order to gain back that fear and respect. Putin finds himself in that corner and he’s too big of a narcissist to simply take the embarrassment.
 
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