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Misc 2021 Spring/Summer Whamby Thread

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Yes they are putting people at risk. Because the vaccine is effective but no vaccine can be 100% effective in preventing a virus, that's just not how our immune systems work sadly. If this many people had measles for example, there would be cases among people who were vaccinated as kids too. Luckily we erradiactaed it by so many people getting the shot over the years and getting herd immunity. We have no reached that with corona. Therefore, thousands of people are getting corona after being responsible and getting vaccinated because they likely caught it from someone who was not vaccinated. I say "likely" becuase those who are not vaxxed are more likely to get sick and spread it around.

Swim at your own risk is truly at your own risk. It doesn't effect others so go ahead and take the risk if you want! Driving is a different story. Unfortunately we do not have a better way to transport ourselves from place to place. BUT you can manage to drive in a safer manner and not drink and drive for example. Because if you drink and drive, you're not only putting yourself at risk but others around you as well. It's the same thing with the vaccine. Sure you may have taken the risk for yourself by driving, but are you factoring in the lives of others?

I've lost family and friends to the virus last year. This is not something I would take lightly because you've seen a few headlines doubting the vaccine on FB or some other news.
I'm sorry for your loss, you are not the only one that has lost a family member or friend to this virus but a few headlines on FB is not what I'm basing my argument on. You like to label and place all non-vaccinated in one category which isn't helpful either, which I could say is the left MO but I'll not because it stirs emotions and stops logical debate.

It also took many years to fully develop the measles vaccine (or any other vaccine as far as that goes), amazing to me that all of a sudden we are so advanced that we can put years worth of research and clinical trials in a 9 month period. You say thousands that have been responsible (suggesting those of us who like to make our own decisions about our own medical situations aren't responsible) are getting covid b/c they likely caught it from someone who was not vaccinated. The CDC has stated that those that are vaccinated can still carry and spread the virus so you really don't know where or from whom they contracted it, that's another assumption aimed at blaming.

You seriously think that I don't even factor in the lives of others as a driver? What? Sorry maybe I missed your point on that one but didn't make much sense to me.

Just curious are we now past "my body my choice"?
 
What? You didn't even respond to a post where I mention driving?

My sister and mother work in a hopsital and has seen people unable to breathe and strictly on tubes regret more than anything not getting the shot. Why? Because its a measly shot in your arm and has no known and logged significant side effects. This is not an issue of personal freedom, this is an issue of public health.
 
What? You didn't even respond to a post where I mention driving?

My sister and mother work in a hopsital and has seen people unable to breathe and strictly on tubes regret more than anything not getting the shot. Why? Because its a measly shot in your arm and has no known and logged significant side effects. This is not an issue of personal freedom, this is an issue of public health.
Wrong
 
What? You didn't even respond to a post where I mention driving?

My sister and mother work in a hopsital and has seen people unable to breathe and strictly on tubes regret more than anything not getting the shot. Why? Because its a measly shot in your arm and has no known and logged significant side effects. This is not an issue of personal freedom, this is an issue of public health.
I was driving and couldn't give you an adequate response. False was a good summation until I got home.
 
There absolutely is scientific evidence to back it up, you just haven't made a significant effort to look into it. Every single new vaccine is not some crazy brand new formula that has never been seen before. This is not the first MRNA vaccine and they are well aware of the potential long term side effects of similar vaccines through years of clinical testing. In fact, historically, any rare extreme side effects occur within the first two months after injection (the J&J vaccine for example with the 1 per million cases of blood clots).

The reason vaccines take so long to get approval is just because of the strict guidelines and lack of resources. But when every country is working together and spending billions in months towards vaccine research, 10 years of work can be done in the matter of 9-10 months. It's really that simple.

You can make your own choice with your own body, but you cannot expect me to sit by and not judge you for the decisions you make. You are putting the lives of others at risk by not recieving a vaccine that 150 million+ people have taken with close to zero problems.

Its just like meteorology, its science. The media might be emotion-based, but you don't have to be. Read the research papers and the scientific data presented to you by immunologists and vaccine experts. Just like you'd listen to my local NWS rep before anyone on this website.
Yes they are putting people at risk. Because the vaccine is effective but no vaccine can be 100% effective in preventing a virus, that's just not how our immune systems work sadly. If this many people had measles for example, there would be cases among people who were vaccinated as kids too. Luckily we erradiactaed it by so many people getting the shot over the years and getting herd immunity. We have no reached that with corona. Therefore, thousands of people are getting corona after being responsible and getting vaccinated because they likely caught it from someone who was not vaccinated. I say "likely" becuase those who are not vaxxed are more likely to get sick and spread it around.

Swim at your own risk is truly at your own risk. It doesn't effect others so go ahead and take the risk if you want! Driving is a different story. Unfortunately we do not have a better way to transport ourselves from place to place. BUT you can manage to drive in a safer manner and not drink and drive for example. Because if you drink and drive, you're not only putting yourself at risk but others around you as well. It's the same thing with the vaccine. Sure you may have taken the risk for yourself by driving, but are you factoring in the lives of others?

I've lost family and friends to the virus last year. This is not something I would take lightly because you've seen a few headlines doubting the vaccine on FB or some other news.

So between these two posts, we are to believe or infer the following things:

1) There is concrete scientific evidence that the Covid vaccine carries little to no risk of long-term side effects, don't worry about it
2) MNRA vaccines have been widely used across vast populations for years, don't worry about it
3) Cures for cancer, Alzheimer's, ALS, Autism, AIDS, etc. would be developed in months if we just had enough money
4) Drug companies who make billions annually are so strapped for cash that it takes years to develop medicine
5) Non-FDA approved medications are great, don't worry about it
6) Strict guidelines that are in place to govern medicine development are useless, needless roadblocks to be summariliy discarded when needed, don't worry about it
7) Nobody thought to use some of the extra money and resources to develop a treatment in case you get Covid
8) Vaccines are the only solution and they work great except those not getting vaccinated make them not work as good, harming vaccinated peeps
9) Peer-reviewed papers give the all clear to long-term issues with Covid vaccines in kids with autism, people with dementia, people with lupus, people with leukemia, people who are trying to get pregnant, kids 8-18 taking a combination of propranolol, amantadine, amiodarone, and digoxin, don't worry about it
10) Measles has been eradicated, don't worry about this one anymore either
11) Judging others' hesitations about getting the virus as ridiculous and unfounded does not show that nearly your entire position is an emotional one
12) Everybody has to get the entirely safe vaccine for everybody to be safe, don't worry about it.

So, I'm going to go ahead on and stick with False. Don't pee on me and tell me it's raining. I don't need a stack of peer-reviewed papers on rain to tell me that yellow stuff spraying at me ain't coming from the sky.
 
I'm sorry for your loss, you are not the only one that has lost a family member or friend to this virus but a few headlines on FB is not what I'm basing my argument on. You like to label and place all non-vaccinated in one category which isn't helpful either, which I could say is the left MO but I'll not because it stirs emotions and stops logical debate.

It also took many years to fully develop the measles vaccine (or any other vaccine as far as that goes), amazing to me that all of a sudden we are so advanced that we can put years worth of research and clinical trials in a 9 month period. You say thousands that have been responsible (suggesting those of us who like to make our own decisions about our own medical situations aren't responsible) are getting covid b/c they likely caught it from someone who was not vaccinated. The CDC has stated that those that are vaccinated can still carry and spread the virus so you really don't know where or from whom they contracted it, that's another assumption aimed at blaming.

You seriously think that I don't even factor in the lives of others as a driver? What? Sorry maybe I missed your point on that one but didn't make much sense to me.

Just curious are we now past "my body my choice"?
A few things and this will probably be my last post abot corona.

I want to start by saying that I am not in favor of mandating a vaccine. It is your body and is your choice. But again, I can judge you for not getting it. And if a state decides to not allow people in certain places without vax verification, thats ok too. Why? Because you can decide not to get the vaccine but not getting it is allowed to have consequences. Same as schools and unis not allowing their students to live/be on campus without getting the meningitis vaccine. Thats been the case for a LONG time too.

You seem to be really interested in how the vaccine was made so quickly! A quick google search would honestly do you a lot of justice in finding out answers to questions like this. Its normal to have a lot of questions, but there are thousands of search results waiting with the answers. The link at the bottom of the post details how it was done so fast. A regular vaccine has millions in funding spread out over years because it isn't an emergency. This vaccine had every top doctor in the world with all of the collaborating countries' resources+money available. Again, MRNA vaccines are not that different from each other and we've had decades of data on those already. I'd check those out!

Yes you are correct, people who are vaccinated can transmit the virus the same fashion as people who are not. But think about it like this: There is a room full of 10 people and a person who has corona (vaxxed or un-vaxxed...it doesnt matter) walks in. If all ten are vaccinated, research shows that the vaccine has around an 88%-90% efficacy against the delta virus. Theoretically only 1-2 people should get it. If all ten are not vaxxed, theres a high likelyhood most if not all ten people will contract it. And guess what? Those people can walk out of the room and spread it to others in other rooms. Whats the better outcome?

Not only this but the more common long term side effects of corona itself are worse than almost all of the side effects associated with any vaccine ever created in existence.

I didn't start the car example because I do not think it relates to this at all. You might take other's lives into acocunt when you drive but if someone theoretically drives drunk, they are not being considerate to other people's lives. Thats all I was saying. But again just forget about that anaology. Let's talk about the actual issue^

I probably will never be able to convince you of anything and your mind seems relatively set. Just please do some research to answer your doubts and questions about the vaccine. There are so many resources online for that. Or straight up, call your primary care doctor and ask them. They didn't go to school for 8 years to tell you lies.

Heres the link I was talking about:
 
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