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Political Thread

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Jessy89 said:
Who on earth would apply or be willing to do such a job. I guarantee you some of these workers would get shot. Because they have no means of protection for themselves.


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Police deaths aren’t any higher in the counties that restrict weapons on police than they are in the USA.

Police deaths in New York and London during the twentieth century - PMC

To describe the incidences and causes of occupational police deaths in New York City in the United States and Greater London in the United Kingdom during the twentieth century. To assess the relation between overall societal violence and violence ...
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

“During the 20th century, 585 police officers in New York and 160 police officers in London died while participating in law enforcement activities.

New York had markedly higher intentional police mortality rates compared to London throughout most of the 20th century.

Intentional gunshot wounds comprised 290 police deaths in New York, but only 14 police deaths in London.

In New York, gunshot wounds (intentional and unintentional) accounted for more occupational police deaths (51.6%) than did all other mechanisms combined.

In London, motor vehicle collision was the most common cause (47.5%) of occupational police death.

There were no correlations between the general population homicide rates and intentional police mortality rates in either New York or London.”


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Jon said:
Plenty of countries operate without armed traffic cops and don’t have lawlessness. Open your eyes fella, there’s a whole world out there that does things the right way and we can learn a lot from them!

90% of London’s police force don’t carry weapons...and when the other 10% respond to crimes with weapons, the outcome is significantly different.


“The Metropolitan Police carried out some 3,300 deployments involving firearms in 2016. They didn't fire a single shot at a suspect.

It's a world away from the United States, where cops killed 1,092 people in 2016, according to figures compiled by The Guardian.”

I say this and ask you, do you think London is a place of absolute lawlessness with a bunch of imposters and rape?
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Lol I know some reps over in London. They say it’s a crap show. Most have no guns and cameras everywhere. They have no privacy. Also they have plenty of crime. It more of a communist living there. Totally different living there than here. They don’t have the freedoms we have. If it’s so great in these other countries why are some staying in the US? Why so many want to move to America? This fella eyes are open and realize the younger generation will bend over without even thinking.
 
Jon said:
Police deaths aren’t any higher in the counties that restrict weapons on police than they are in the USA.

Police deaths in New York and London during the twentieth century - PMC

To describe the incidences and causes of occupational police deaths in New York City in the United States and Greater London in the United Kingdom during the twentieth century. To assess the relation between overall societal violence and violence ...
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

“During the 20th century, 585 police officers in New York and 160 police officers in London died while participating in law enforcement activities.

New York had markedly higher intentional police mortality rates compared to London throughout most of the 20th century.

Intentional gunshot wounds comprised 290 police deaths in New York, but only 14 police deaths in London.

In New York, gunshot wounds (intentional and unintentional) accounted for more occupational police deaths (51.6%) than did all other mechanisms combined.

In London, motor vehicle collision was the most common cause (47.5%) of occupational police death.

There were no correlations between the general population homicide rates and intentional police mortality rates in either New York or London.”


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They don’t have guns over there like here. We can’t compare true numbers.
To all those that think this is a great idea. Then join this force. Good luck!
 
Jon said:
This isn’t those countries? What do you mean by that?
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Have you not been paying attention. Shooting and crime has escalated in this country and riots continue. This is a dangerous idea here. We absolutely must have cops with guns here


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Matthew70 said:
They don’t have guns over there like here. We can’t compare true numbers.
To all those that think this is a great idea. Then join this force. Good luck!
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Good luck to you too. Just sharing opinions here, don’t be so dismissive and have a conversation.

You make a point about the guns, we have a huge gun problem. But no one wants to fix that, why not at least try to fix both?
 
Jessy89 said:
Have you not been paying attention. Shooting and crime has escalated in this country and riots continue. This is a dangerous idea here. We absolutely must have cops with guns here


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I’ve been paying attention — your post was without context and made no freaking sense. So we aren’t like other countries in the setting of gun violence, well hell thats definitely something we can agree on there! A no brainer!

We can have police with guns. Our police force can be re-designed to approach certain calls differently and it can be more effective with less senseless killings. Why are we stuck on not even brainstorming any change at all?
 
Jon said:
I’ve been paying attention — your post was without context and made no freaking sense. So we aren’t like other countries in the setting of gun violence, well hell thats definitely something we can agree on there! A no brainer!

We can have police with guns. Our police force can be re-designed to approach certain calls differently and it can be more effective with less senseless killings. Why are we stuck on not even brainstorming any change at all?
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So we would have unarmed people of authority pulling people over?
 
Jon said:
I’ve been paying attention — your post was without context and made no freaking sense. So we aren’t like other countries in the setting of gun violence, well hell thats definitely something we can agree on there! A no brainer!

We can have police with guns. Our police force can be re-designed to approach certain calls differently and it can be more effective with less senseless killings. Why are we stuck on not even brainstorming any change at all?
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I agree with most that. My only concern as someone else said what happens when a known felon is pulled over and hits shoots the person that pulled him over. That person dead and never had a chance because he had no gun. We should absolutely brainstorm how to train law enforcement to use appropriate force vs George Floyd situations. But disarming police isn’t the answer.


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Jessy89 said:
I agree with most that. My only concern as someone else said what happens when a known felon is pulled over and hits shoots the person that pulled him over. That person dead and never had a chance because he had no gun. We should absolutely brainstorm how to train law enforcement to use appropriate force vs George Floyd situations. But disarming police isn’t the answer.


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Police do a great good overall. Yes a few times it’s not so great. Some doctors suck as well.
 
Number 1: There are tons of guns and tons of people with guns people with guns and tons of criminals with tons of guns in the US.

Number 2: Number 2 isn't going to change anytime soon, even though some wish it would.

Number 3: Having an unarmed police force is an absolutely terrible idea for this country.

If a few bad police are the problem we're trying to solve, then let's do what it takes to weed those out and do our best from preventing them from joining in the first place.

And let's use some common sense and understand that even the best people make mistakes. That's going to be part of the process. Is it sad and unfortunate? It sure is. But it is also part of an imperfect life in an imperfect world.
 
Jon said:
I’ve been paying attention — your post was without context and made no freaking sense. So we aren’t like other countries in the setting of gun violence, well hell thats definitely something we can agree on there! A no brainer!

We can have police with guns. Our police force can be re-designed to approach certain calls differently and it can be more effective with less senseless killings. Why are we stuck on not even brainstorming any change at all?
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Understood but you wouldnt think a call to wake up a drunk in the drive through at wendy's would end up with 2 cops wrestling the drunk for a tazer, one cop being knocked to the ground concussed, the other being shot at before the drunk was unfortunately killed. Just last year a routine stop in downtown Raleigh led to an RPD officer being shot in the face at point blank range. You are unfortunately living in a mean society........
 
Jon said:
I’ve been paying attention — your post was without context and made no freaking sense. So we aren’t like other countries in the setting of gun violence, well hell thats definitely something we can agree on there! A no brainer!

We can have police with guns. Our police force can be re-designed to approach certain calls differently and it can be more effective with less senseless killings. Why are we stuck on not even brainstorming any change at all?
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Yep this is the real issue....
 
Jon said:
Good luck to you too. Just sharing opinions here, don’t be so dismissive and have a conversation.

You make a point about the guns, we have a huge gun problem. But no one wants to fix that, why not at least try to fix both?
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Jon I agree gun violence sucks. I was raised around guns and taught at an early age about them. My kids also. I think kids need to learn education of guns early in age. I do believe gun laws need to be more strict in some ways but banning them I’m totally against. The majority of individuals that have guns respect everyone. Do you own any guns Jon? What is your thinking on having guns and gun laws?
 
Rain Cold said:
Number 1: There are tons of guns and tons of people with guns people with guns and tons of criminals with tons of guns in the US.

Number 2: Number 2 isn't going to change anytime soon, even though some wish it would.

Number 3: Having an unarmed police force is an absolutely terrible idea for this country.

If a few bad police are the problem we're trying to solve, then let's do what it takes to weed those out and do our best from preventing them from joining in the first place.

And let's use some common sense and understand that even the best people make mistakes. That's going to be part of the process. Is it sad and unfortunate? It sure is. But it is also part of an imperfect life in an imperfect world.
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The problem is police forces do not police themselves the blue wall is a very real thing, its not just a few bad policeman, the entire culture needs a massive overhaul.....its the fact that if one cop does something wrong in front of 5 other cops more often than not nothing is said or reported, so that makes them all bad cops.....the amount of force police think they can use is gotten way out of hand, so many videos of cops just swinging away on people, grown ass men hitting women and stuff over what is essentially nothing. Sometimes you got to tear the house down to the foundation and just start over.....
 
Downeastnc said:
I agree, so many traffic stops end up in deadly encounters over nothing.....enforcing traffic laws could easily be performed by non police individuals who only have the power to write tickets. like you said this is already done by most major nations throughout the world.
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Another issue is that traffic laws are seen as revenue generation by a lot of police departments. We don't need government employees hanging out at every significant highway every day looking to hand out speeding tickets, whether they be police or otherwise. It's questionable as to whether tickets even work to improve traffic safety.

Reduce enforcement, hand over more of it to non-police who are instructed not to pursue or engage if a violator flees, just get their plate number.
 
VegasEagle said:
Small view of the world
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How so, there is better ways to do it, the entire aspect of what law enforcement means and is needs to be overhauled, I have several family members that are officers, one in LA....I am not anti cop and I certainly dont think we need to remove guns from cops in general but there are times when them being armed leads to people dying that shouldnt.
 
Downeastnc said:
How so, there is better ways to do it, the entire aspect of what law enforcement means and is needs to be overhauled, I have several family members that are officers, one in LA....I am not anti cop and I certainly dont think we need to remove guns from cops in general but there are times when them being armed leads to people dying that shouldnt.
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Just like times when armed criminals lead to cops dying that shouldnt.
 
Downeastnc said:
The problem is police forces do not police themselves the blue wall is a very real thing, its not just a few bad policeman, the entire culture needs a massive overhaul.....its the fact that if one cop does something wrong in front of 5 other cops more often than not nothing is said or reported, so that makes them all bad cops.....the amount of force police think they can use is gotten way out of hand, so many videos of cops just swinging away on people, grown ass men hitting women and stuff over what is essentially nothing. Sometimes you got to tear the house down to the foundation and just start over.....
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Either you havent spent much time in the midst of the blue wall or perhaps greeneville PD has given you a warped perception of the profession as a whole? What you are suggesting isnt even close to reality. Rogue officers are an extremely small % even in larger departments
 
Matthew70 said:
Jon I agree gun violence sucks. I was raised around guns and taught at an early age about them. My kids also. I think kids need to learn education of guns early in age. I do believe gun laws need to be more strict in some ways but banning them I’m totally against. The majority of individuals that have guns respect everyone. Do you own any guns Jon? What is your thinking on having guns and gun laws?
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I was raised around guns and hunted, had a duck hunting license in Texas at 8. I go to my in laws in WV and shoot all the time. I own a gun for self defense only. With all that said, I’m for stricter gun control laws and don’t believe there’s justification in owning AR-15 style rifles, even though I have family who build their own custom kits. I personally just don’t get it, but I’ve shot them...my opinion on why they shouldn’t be around outweighs any amount of fun I have doing so. It would be harder for me to give up my self defense weapon, I’d admit...but could I do it? Probably...
 
Downeastnc said:
How so, there is better ways to do it, the entire aspect of what law enforcement means and is needs to be overhauled, I have several family members that are officers, one in LA....I am not anti cop and I certainly dont think we need to remove guns from cops in general but there are times when them being armed leads to people dying that shouldnt.
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What happens when a officer does because he has no gun to protect himself? He thinks a routine traffic stop and the driver shoots and kills a unarmed officer. What then?


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Sandbar said:
Either you havent spent much time in the midst of the blue wall or perhaps greeneville PD has given you a warped perception of the profession as a whole? What you are suggesting isnt even close to reality. Rogue officers are an extremely small % even in larger departments
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I agree, but in general good cops know that other cops are dirty or go too far with force and they say nothing.....that is the blue wall, and it makes them complicit and part of the problem, and its pervasive and COMMON for officers to look the other way and not report abuses. Heck I have seen it happen first hand numerous times working in clubs and bars downtown in Greenville....cops learn early on that snitches need stitches, and that they must protect the blue wall.....hell you even see it in the hundreds of videos of cops using excessive force with their fellow officers standing there watching and not STOPPING it from happening.....so if 10% of cops are dirty or use to much force and the other 90% watch and say nothing then they are ALL part of the problem.
 
Jon said:
I was raised around guns and hunted, had a duck hunting license in Texas at 8. I go to my in laws in WV and shoot all the time. I own a gun for self defense only. With all that said, I’m for stricter gun control laws and don’t believe there’s justification in owning AR-15 style rifles, even though I have family who build their own custom kits. I personally just don’t get it, but I’ve shot them...my opinion on why they shouldn’t be around outweighs any amount of fun I have doing so. It would be harder for me to give up my self defense weapon, I’d admit...but could I do it? Probably...
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I am curious to know why there is no justification for owning an AR-15 but a handgun for self defense is ok?
 
Downeastnc said:
How so, there is better ways to do it, the entire aspect of what law enforcement means and is needs to be overhauled, I have several family members that are officers, one in LA....I am not anti cop and I certainly dont think we need to remove guns from cops in general but there are times when them being armed leads to people dying that shouldnt.
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Not trying to call you out. But, small view. Let me play a game with some swag numbers.There is like 700,000 officers in the USA. Maybe an average of 2.8 contacts with the general public a day. So let's just cut them numbers more than half and say there is a million contacts between the public and police officers a day. That is 365 million interactions a year. How many people die unjustly in a year from a police officer? I have read that 9 unarmed black people died from white cops last year, with half being cleared with eyewitness evidence (numbers are not verified). Not bad, even though any life lost is sad and terrible. But, humans are evil. There is evil police men, there is evil doctors, and heck there is evil mailmen. These ideas are about as bad as someone not wearing a mask in public or creating a game of jump to conclusions pad.
 
Jon said:
I was raised around guns and hunted, had a duck hunting license in Texas at 8. I go to my in laws in WV and shoot all the time. I own a gun for self defense only. With all that said, I’m for stricter gun control laws and don’t believe there’s justification in owning AR-15 style rifles, even though I have family who build their own custom kits. I personally just don’t get it, but I’ve shot them...my opinion on why they shouldn’t be around outweighs any amount of fun I have doing so. It would be harder for me to give up my self defense weapon, I’d admit...but could I do it? Probably...
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Appreciate your honesty.
 
Sandbar said:
I am curious to know why there is no justification for owning an AR-15 but a handgun for self defense is ok?
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I personally don’t find justification, but find the justification for a small handgun for personal safety. I can’t really debate the point you want me to debate with you, it’s a tired argument and there’s plenty of threads online that say why or why not, why it’s hypocritical to pick and choose, etc. I just don’t see it that way. Just my take.
 
Downeastnc said:
I agree, but in general good cops know that other cops are dirty or go too far with force and they say nothing.....that is the blue wall, and it makes them complicit and part of the problem, and its pervasive and COMMON for officers to look the other way and not report abuses. Heck I have seen it happen first hand numerous times working in clubs and bars downtown in Greenville....cops learn early on that snitches need stitches, and that they must protect the blue wall.....hell you even see it in the hundreds of videos of cops using excessive force with their fellow officers standing there watching and not STOPPING it from happening.....so if 10% of cops are dirty or use to much force and the other 90% watch and say nothing then they are ALL part of the problem.
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That does happen, and , always will. Maybe more police groups will start adding a countability law . That is the only good to come out of this mess. But, your views are on a bad scale of economics. It IS not a rampant by the hour 24/ 7 police beat down party. I think it might appear like that to you, for you are younger .
 
Heelyes said:
Trump's new ad is good, he uses actual footage of his country burning while he is in office to convince you it will happen if Biden is elected.
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Lol that ad is super dramatic. “If you’re calling for rape, press 1. Murder, press 2. Home invasion, press 3. Wait time 5 days. Goodbye.” Talk about “fear porn”
 
Jon said:
Lol that ad is super dramatic. “If you’re calling for rape, press 1. Murder, press 2. Home invasion, press 3. Wait time 5 days. Goodbye.” Talk about “fear porn”
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It’s the future with no police


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