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Pattern December Discussion

whatalife link said:
[quote author=Storm5 link=topic=2.msg2255#msg2255 date=1481853788]
[quote author=GaWx link=topic=2.msg2247#msg2247 date=1481851121]
JB's Twitter is relatively quiet today. That is not a good sign. By the way, the SAI is once again so far not working out but the idea is a solid -AO when averaged out over DJF. It can still flip strongly enough to -AO in JF to make it work this winter, but the prospects for that are hurt by the projected solid +AO for Dec as there is a decent correlation. The chances for a -AO in JF are clearly higher when Dec is also negative.

I sure hope things turnaround sharply a la 2013-14. That was a negative neutral ENSO with a stout SE ridge in Dec. Also, 1961-2 was somewhat similar. Those two winters ended up being banner winters at least per Atlanta wintry precip.
Yeah a  2013-2014 turnaround is our best hope at this point . clearly now the first part of January isn't going to be very pretty. I guess we could have dumb luck and score along the way. The question then becomes IF we get into a better pattern how long does it last cause everything right now sure points to a horrible february. I know webber has some good stats and stuff rolling the pattern forward . Analogs don't offer a light at the end of the tunnel. They just off a dark tunnel. So I'm with your statement above about a 2013-2014 turnaround. It's gonna be badly needed

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I have a feeling I'll be tilling a garden in FEB (JK). I'm not overly hopeful that we're going to see a -AO and if we do it may very well be short lived.

I'm looking for maybe a 2 week window sometime mid January for us to possibly score and after that the winter shop may very well be closed for the SE. Here's to hoping for a 2013-2014 turn around...


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I think our 2 week window is here, and we are gonna whiff!
 
halfway through December and this is where we stand . Image from WSI
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It looks like we may end with a Dec AO that is greater than +1. 11 of 15 of the subsequent Jan's following also ended up with a +AO and only 1 of these 15 winters averaged a solidly -AO for DJF (1979-80). So, the SAI is once again in deep doodoo.

Of the 15 Dec.'s since 1950 that had an AO that was +1+, two of them were either a neutral negative or weak La Nina: 2011-12 and 2013-4. Both switched to a -AO Jan although only modeslty so in 2012. 2014's Jan AO fell to  ~-1. As I also said, the SE ridge was strong in Dec.of 2013 and it was gone by Jan. So, whereas I'm not betting on this, this at least gives us hope for a -AO and the end of the SE ridge domination in Jan.
 
Re: December Discussion

interesting gfs run. brings snow from Oklahoma through Arkansas and tennesse the day after Christmas 
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oh this run was close here Christmas night

HA that storm to open 2017... too bad its a gazillion hours out
 
Regarding the winter of 2013-4, a hope for 2016-7 though not a bet, it was similar to now in a negative neutral ENSO state with a strong SE ridge in Dec. along with a solidly +AO Dec. Here are the Dec dailies, which were solidly positive til 12/29. The last three days of the month were negative:

2013 12  1  2.302
2013 12  2  1.861
2013 12  3  1.632
2013 12  4  1.062
2013 12  5  0.426
2013 12  6 -0.137
2013 12  7  0.332
2013 12  8  1.262
2013 12  9  0.883
2013 12 10  0.378
2013 12 11  0.399
2013 12 12  1.416
2013 12 13  1.918
2013 12 14  3.179
2013 12 15  4.303
2013 12 16  3.798
2013 12 17  3.308
2013 12 18  2.621
2013 12 19  1.722
2013 12 20  2.420
2013 12 21  3.040
2013 12 22  2.815
2013 12 23  2.139
2013 12 24  1.293
2013 12 25  0.695
2013 12 26  0.582
2013 12 27  0.239
2013 12 28  0.072
2013 12 29 -0.086
2013 12 30 -0.584
2013 12 31 -1.198

Then comes January 2014, which was heavily dominated by -AO dailies:

2014  1  1 -1.558
2014  1  2 -1.318
2014  1  3 -1.139
2014  1  4 -1.657
2014  1  5 -1.836
2014  1  6 -1.573
2014  1  7 -1.376
2014  1  8  0.097
2014  1  9  1.417
2014  1 10  1.240
2014  1 11  0.498
2014  1 12  0.240
2014  1 13 -0.095
2014  1 14 -0.668
2014  1 15 -0.526
2014  1 16 -1.065
2014  1 17 -1.717
2014  1 18 -2.255
2014  1 19 -2.426
2014  1 20 -2.227
2014  1 21 -1.843
2014  1 22 -1.263
2014  1 23 -0.774
2014  1 24  0.276
2014  1 25  0.133
2014  1 26 -1.432
2014  1 27 -2.605
2014  1 28 -2.408
2014  1 29 -1.304
2014  1 30 -0.145
2014  1 31  0.341
 
It certainly doesn't help matters when we get a twin westerly QBO regime, and the WAFz is not very disruptive (aside from Hurricane Nicole Nicole in October) wrt weakening the polar vortex with equatorward & cross-equatorial rossby wave progression dominating the picture. The Siberian Snowfall Advance Index serves as an approximation for wave activity flux (essentially measuring the intensity of tropospheric rossby waves' upwelling into the stratosphere & depositing westerly momentum which slows down the easterly polar night jet surrounding the Polar vortex), and is useful in a sense that it gives us a general idea of the intensity of mid-latitude rossby & planetary waves and their location wrt the mid-high latitude waveguide (a waveguide refers to features such as jet stream, mountain range, baroclinic zone, or any other feature that changes the amplitude & movement of Rossby Waves). The SAI's timing is such that its measured when the polar vortex observes its most rapid evolution (which usually occurs in October), and the values are dependent on the placement of these Rossby Waves, if they are positioned in a way that enhances the standing planetary wave configuration (Planetary waves are essentially quasi-stationary, large waves influenced by seasonal changes & mountain ranges), SAI values increase (You should take note once again that the Plaentary Wave configuration is dependent on the large-scale mountain ranges, with ridging occurring on the windward (western (in the NH)) side of a mountain range, and troughs on the lee (eastern) side. In North America for example a significant portion this planetary wave configuration can be described by the PNA pattern with a mean ridge over the Rockies, trough in eastern North America & trough near the Aleutians) (hence why you should note that most very high SAI years occur during El Ninos because El Ninos tend to enhance the PNA pattern). There are other parameters that can significantly modify or skew this WAFz indicator such as abnormally low arctic & Barents/Kara Sea Ice, an extreme NINO (as was observed last year) or extreme westerly QBO regime (as we're currently observed), both of these aforementioned features but have dominated the past several years in some way, shape, or form, have occurred with relatively low frequency in the observed record, although one (low arctic sea ice) or more of features may become more prevalent in the coming decades. This just goes to show once again that one-dimensional indicators can't provide a complete picture of a multi-faceted, highly non-linear system & phenomena such as the AO, you really have to look @ the large-scale picture instead of cherry-picking only what you want to see.

As far as February is concerned, I think we may have a decent indication of the probability of February turning out to be above average &/or a blowtorch as most guidance suggests or colder than normal once January's pattern unveils itself. Based on what I've seen wrt the progression of winters with a similar ENSO/QBO background, if an anomalous trough is closer to southeastern Canada & the Great Lakes and high-latitude blocking dominates Scandinavia & the far eastern North Atlantic in January, we might be in business in Feb. However, if the trough is closer to the Canadian Rockies & there's little-no high latitude north Atlantic blocking (as was the case during the warm set of WQBO/ENSO years), we may be in trouble. Even if we observe the former pattern, there's still no guarantee of a colder than average Feb, the probability would certainly increase though...
 
Good ole JB...He just mentioned the Brazilian for ATL...Nothing says winter like March and April snow...SMH!
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whatalife link said:
Good ole JB...He just mentioned the Brazilian for ATL...Nothing says winter like March and April snow...SMH!
f7f878f2263b9c382fb4e3a42043038f.jpg



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hahah give me the snow around January 1st and it will be a successful winter. March snows are just annoying , unless it's a 93 like system lol.

JB and the Brazilian lol desperation is setting in

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I am starting to understand why there are so many weather models....if you don't like what you see with one model; you certainly can find it with another
 
If we could get another two week period like we did in Jan 2000, then it wouldn't matter how the rest of winter ends up. It does seem since then most of our winters have been all or nothing. Hard to remember the last time we had a winter with wall to wall storms every month from December through February. It seems if we do get anything now it comes in one or two week stretches. 
 
Brick Tamland link said:
If we could get another two week period like we did in Jan 2000, then it wouldn't matter how the rest of winter ends up. It does seem since then most of our winters have been all or nothing. Hard to remember the last time we had a winter with wall to wall storms every month from December through February. It seems if we do get anything now it comes in one or two week stretches.

It think it would be hard to find more than a handful of winters where RDU had a decent winter storm in all 3 winter months. Trace amounts, maybe. I just don't think we are in a location to score constantly, if we can get 2-3 weeks maybe a month of great winter that to me is a success.
 
The 12z GFS says the drought gets worse in SC and GA over the next 2 weeks. Tenn and AL are ok so far, but the trend is to take the precip farther north and west with each run. If it is going to be dry, I'm hoping for 70-75 temps to come and stay for a while.
 
glad to see the post Christmas changeoverpocalypse is still on the table
 
bigstick10 link said:
The forecast for ATL is odd Sunday they do not mention this whatsoever.

sun_6a.jpg
http://www.jamesspann.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/sun_6a.jpg

Hmm, on the far east side of that map, you can see cooler temps in Rabun, Habersham, Banks counties. Couldn't be a residual cool pool from today/tomorrow's wedge right?
 
Thundersnow89 link said:
glad to see the post Christmas changeoverpocalypse is still on the table
I love a good wraparound!!
Those always work out!
 
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