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Wintry January 3rd-6th, 2018 Winter Storm The ARCC/Xtreme Weather Special

Gefs getting more excited
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Don't y'all just love the weather. Lol.
***Ok kind of a longer post***
I for one don't think the trends are over yet at all, good or bad** it does concern me that the NAM (both 12km and 3km) virually has no support on how strong of a solution it's showing. Does it meannits wrong, no not all, but we know NAM loves to over do things as well. In fact it's usually awful at it. With that being said do I think it could be on to something absolutely. rgem will be a big help as well, but remember it still runs with a parent global, the CMC and can have a progressive bias as well. I really wish the euro had more support toward a NAM type solution to feel more comfortable about it. I will say the doc did trend toward the NAM a bit with more tilt and a slightly sooner phase there are 2 massive wild cards, IMHO here, 1. Where and when the phase happens (clearly the NAM is further west with that process then any other model) and 2. All the vorticity bombs/spikes/whatever in the western Atlantic. Those are going to force the SFC low out from the coast. So I expect them to trend less with time, yes. And I think that's been apparent with all models showing the SFC low closer to the coast.
In the end tonight's runs will be HUGE!! President Trump's HUGE voice. Lol will the NAM continue it's massive solution? (Both 12 and 3km) if it does then we might*** have a trendsetter OR if it starts to buckle and go toward the other models, well then I think we are in trouble for most outside coastal areas.
Map coming soon, no amounts yet to be honest.
 
deltadog03 said:
Don't y'all just love the weather. Lol.
***Ok kind of a longer post***
I for one don't think the trends are over yet at all, good or bad** it does concern me that the NAM (both 12km and 3km) virually has no support on how strong of a solution it's showing. Does it meannits wrong, no not all, but we know NAM loves to over do things as well. In fact it's usually awful at it. With that being said do I think it could be on to something absolutely. rgem will be a big help as well, but remember it still runs with a parent global, the CMC and can have a progressive bias as well. I really wish the euro had more support toward a NAM type solution to feel more comfortable about it. I will say the doc did trend toward the NAM a bit with more tilt and a slightly sooner phase there are 2 massive wild cards, IMHO here, 1. Where and when the phase happens (clearly the NAM is further west with that process then any other model) and 2. All the vorticity bombs/spikes/whatever in the western Atlantic. Those are going to force the SFC low out from the coast. So I expect them to trend less with time, yes. And I think that's been apparent with all models showing the SFC low closer to the coast.
In the end tonight's runs will be HUGE!! President Trump's HUGE voice. Lol will the NAM continue it's massive solution? (Both 12 and 3km) if it does then we might*** have a trendsetter OR if it starts to buckle and go toward the other models, well then I think we are in trouble for most outside coastal areas.
Map coming soon, no amounts yet to be honest.
Click to expand...

The waves should both be sampled just fine. With an ingest of new data for 00z, if the NAM holds on, or amplifies even more; I'll feel more confident. Something has to give in this situation. My gut says NAM will start to back down.
 
When's the next NAM ing begin?
 
Yeh as much as I want the NAM to keep NAMing. I got a gut feeling the NAM is gonna hurt a lot of feelings for us inland folks on the 00z runs
 
To show you how far off the NAM is from the GEFS & EPS for the CAE area:

GEFS:
KCAE_2018010112_gefs_snow_384.png


EPS:
KCAE_2018010112_eps24_snow_360.png


If the NAM were to verify with it's 12/18z runs, it would be embarrassing to those two.
 
12k NAM is out in left field guys, if anything the 3km version looks plausible based on the surface reflections. I still can’t figure why the globals are not slinging more QPF inland given a bombing low off the Carolina’s. End result is the NAM will likely meet the GFS / ECMWF in the middle. If anything I feel less confident how this will play out than 24hrs ago. Moderate snow event for Florence to Norfolk, possiblility for a foot in NE NC and SE VA. Still expect to see a slight NW correction now that we are inside 48hrs, FAY to RWI should do very well.
 
Shawn said:
To show you how far off the NAM is from the GEFS & EPS for the CAE area:

GEFS:
KCAE_2018010112_gefs_snow_384.png


EPS:
KCAE_2018010112_eps24_snow_360.png


If the NAM were to verify with it's 12/18z runs, it would be embarrassing to those two.
Click to expand...
Dang...what a difference. I'm with you as well, not buying into the NAM's solution yet either. That'd be quite a coup for it to pull that off, esp. with no other support really.
 
The 18Z RGEM is a huge hit SAV-CHS with qpf of 0.80-0.60" through the end of the run at hour 48. It starts as IP/ZR initially changing to snow for most of it based on 850s going back below 0C. And this is before this storm is over, especially for CHS. So, the implication of this would be qpf likely approaching 0.90"-1.00" for wintry qpf. for the entire storm for SAV-CHS, an amount that SAV hasn't even come close to seeing since the severe 1/1922 icestorm! Yes, I know not to bet on this much qpf at this stage with the main global models having way less and a storm like this being extremely rare but at least it isn't insane like what the last couple of NAMs showed. Also, that seems plausible with this setup and considering the GFS is slowly but steadily trending NW with the qpf.

Three things worth noting about this run:
- NNE move of the sfc low from Grand Bahama Island associated with a big SE coast hit
- This run suggests about a 12 hour long storm
- This is another recent model run suggesting an earlier start (as early as 3 AM Wed) than some models have been showing.
 
Don't think this comes much if any west of 95 and maybe even closer to the coast than that. In storms like the one in 1989 and the Crusher, cut off of snow line was very sharp and distinct.
 
WeatherNC said:
12k NAM is out in left field guys, if anything the 3km version looks plausible based on the surface reflections. I still can’t figure why the globals are not slinging more QPF inland given a bombing low off the Carolina’s. End result is the NAM will likely meet the GFS / ECMWF in the middle. If anything I feel less confident how this will play out than 24hrs ago. Moderate snow event for Florence to Norfolk, possiblility for a foot in NE NC and SE VA. Still expect to see a slight NW correction now that we are inside 48hrs, FAY to RWI should do very well.
Click to expand...
It's plain and simple.... It's too dry in the lower levels. There will be some snow in the Piedmont, but none of it will ever reach the ground unless those lower levels moisten up a lot. That's the problem.
 
For Phil:

That same 18Z RGEM has about 13 straight hours of ZR in Gainesville, FL, (~midnight - 1 PM Wednesday) adding up to a whopping 0.60" of ZR! I suspect that would be an all-time icestorm record for there if that were to verify as I'm not even aware of a single major icestorm on record there! Phil are you aware of any?
Unlike further north in the SAV-CHS corridor, I can more readily buy a lot of ZR because 850s are +4 to +5, which is a common 850 range for major ZR.

So, Phil could conceivably be the member hit the hardest in a sense. Is that unreal?

Edit: I wouldn't be surprised if a 0.60" ZR icestorm would be a multi-hundred year long record at Gainseville!
 
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