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Coronavirus (Stay on Topic)

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I can't expect or rely on you to keep me from getting sick. I can't expect or require Cooper to force everyone home so i can go shopping without fear of Covid. If I have a pre-existing condition, or generally don't want to take the risk of contracting Covid then It is on me to make the choices and decisions that will keep me safe. Even if we tighten the restrictions, and someone is only allowed to hit up the grocery store, how do you know a Pre-symptomatic or asymptomatic didn't touch that box of cereal, shopping cart, pin pad etc. I know stores say they clean, but c'mon it's a bunch of teenagers working there, how well they really cleaning? So we've not really reduced my exposure to Covid, while managing to put thousands out of work.

I can't in good consciousness tell someone they can't work so I can feel better about being in the grocery store. The Irony here for me is, if we Restrict things so hard that it actually reduces my risk of exposure, I wouldn't be allowed to go to the places i'd want to go to. IF we restricted access to Footlocker so much that my chances to contract Covid were reduced; I myself wouldn't be allowed into Footlocker...

Just about anything and everything is available for online order for someone who wants to stay home and stay safe. I also believe people should be allowed to Work From home (if able) if they desire. My boss has a standing order that Everyone be in the office on the same day 1 day a week. However, I do have a teammate who is concerned about her health, and she is allowed to WFH that day. I have no problem with that.

To round this out, there are inherent risks with anything and everything we do. It is up to me to weigh the risk and mitigate where possible. My wife and I are planning on going to Vegas next summer (Covid allowing). I purposefully bought her and I tickets on different Planes. I.E. I'll fly out at Noon on one plane, and she'll fly out at 2pm on different plane. That way, if one of our planes crash, the hope is one parent is still alive.
 
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metwannabe said:
Well FB and Twitter, I just can't lol.... Problem is, at least from my perspective, it's difficult to give a solid solution because 1) I don't have access to or know all the facts 2) I don't trust the "data" we're being given. Look I don't doubt there is a virus, I don't think it's a hoax, I don't doubt people suffer and die from it..... what I do not know and doubt is that the total number of deaths is solely COVID related. Almost 3 million people die a year in the US, so far 286k have died this year from COVID, we're told. I know you and other's will think this sounds morbid, but I can't help but wonder of those 286K how many would have died during this time frame from something else unrelated to COVID. We all hear all kinds of things, some definite, some rumors, some conspiracy and I'm no exception, I've got friends in the medical field that have said they were told to count any death of anyone that tested positive as a COVID death (whether COVID was the cause or not). Do I believe them? Maybe, I don't know.... our governor for instance keeps talking about the science and the data but all of that data has never been revealed to everyone.

Only solution I have is protect the most vulnerable, tightest restrictions on Rest homes/Nursing homes/Medical residential facilities (should've been in place from day 1), government wants to get involved in retail business let them force businesses to set certain hours for the older population then sanitize and allow the general public to come in (some stores did this for a while on their own), our most vulnerable should be first in line for the vaccine, open schools (it can be done with specific guidelines), people need to be working and school closures are a nightmare for the workforce, don't restrict the least vulnerable population the most, I don't know maybe restrict the travel of those with underlying conditions or the elderly. None of this I'm sure makes sense, although it makes every bit as much sense as a curfew. It makes as much sense as allowing hundreds and thousands to pile into retail stores while only 10 can gather at my house....it's complicated and it's obvious government implemented plans aren't the answer.
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I look at excess deaths, that tells you where we are IMO, there is a running average in the US of deaths per week/month/year etc. so we know how many people die on average every week/month or year etc....so by comparing actual deaths so far this year to expected deaths we can see how many of these deaths exceed "natural" deaths.

I see a lot of people say things like I highlighted above.....IE, well that person was going to die anyways, or how many Covid deaths are people that would have died anyways this year etc.....the number of deaths per year versus actual deaths per year will show that. It accounts for the "suppose" to die people and any deaths above that average is considered excessive deaths.....right now the excessive deaths count in the US has exceeded 300k for 2020, this means that at this point in the year over 300k more Americans have died versus the running average for the same time period in previous years. This number matches well with the Covid deaths so the number of Covid deaths and the number of "extra" dead Americans suggest that most of these people would still be alive without Covid....
 
Downeastnc said:
I look at excess deaths, that tells you where we are IMO, there is a running average in the US of deaths per week/month/year etc. so we know how many people die on average every week/month or year etc....so by comparing actual deaths so far this year to expected deaths we can see how many of these deaths exceed "natural" deaths.

I see a lot of people say things like I highlighted above.....IE, well that person was going to die anyways, or how many Covid deaths are people that would have died anyways this year etc.....the number of deaths per year versus actual deaths per year will show that. It accounts for the "suppose" to die people and any deaths above that average is considered excessive deaths.....right now the excessive deaths count in the US has exceeded 300k for 2020, this means that at this point in the year over 300k more Americans have died versus the running average for the same time period in previous years. This number matches well with the Covid deaths so the number of Covid deaths and the number of "extra" dead Americans suggest that most of these people would still be alive without Covid....
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Valid points but I never said "they were going to die anyway", that is a morbid way to think of it, I'd like to think I have more class then that.. And I'm not gonna debate it because neither of us have those actual facts, sure you can compare overall numbers to previous years and I see how one can make that deduction (certain media outlets have already done that) but without all unbiased data it is almost impossible to know if it is a valid comparison.

I find it interesting that we've been told that during the lock downs there were actually fewer "non-covid" related patients in hospitals due to less people out and about, less accidents, incidents etc yet we're told the death count exceeds last years by the exact number of COVID deaths. One would think numbers would be lower due to the reduction in all of the non-covid hospitalizations. Again flame away but I just am a skeptic on all the data/numbers/ fear facts as I like to call them.
 
metwannabe said:
Valid points but I never said "they were going to die anyway", that is a morbid way to think of it, I'd like to think I have more class then that.. And I'm not gonna debate it because neither of us have those actual facts, sure you can compare overall numbers to previous years and I see how one can make that deduction (certain media outlets have already done that) but without all unbiased data it is almost impossible to know if it is a valid comparison.

I find it interesting that we've been told that during the lock downs there were actually fewer "non-covid" related patients in hospitals due to less people out and about, less accidents, incidents etc yet we're told the death count exceeds last years by the exact number of COVID deaths. One would think numbers would be lower due to the reduction in all of the non-covid hospitalizations. Again flame away but I just am a skeptic on all the data/numbers/ fear facts as I like to call them.
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Yeah just looking at a few quick data points on deaths that should be lower due to less travel etc ( car crashes for instance ) and while they are a bit lower its not much.....car accidents deaths are actually up over 2019 numbers....

www.caranddriver.com

2019 U.S. Traffic Deaths Lowest Since 2014, but 2020 Numbers Aren't Looking Good

In the COVID-19 era, fatal accident percentages are up this year despite the smaller number of vehicles on the roads, NHTSA's latest data shows.
www.caranddriver.com www.caranddriver.com
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metwannabe said:
Prove it, prove every single one of them contracted the virus from an individual not wearing a mask in public. You can't. Now do mask help? Maybe but to blame all cases and deaths on those not wearing a stupid mask is as absurd as a 10 pm curfew to mitigate the spread.
In fact, I know of numerous cases where the exposure were coworkers, wearing mask.
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Prove they didn’t. The onus is on you to prove a negative.


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My school district is going virtual starting Monday for a week and then we are out until January. They are actually canceling all sports too. The meltdowns have already begun on FB ?‍♀️ Between the people complaining about school closing and the ones claiming covid is a hoax, it's not surprising Marshall County has the highest positively rate in the state and in the top 5 per capita in the country. The mayor posted the numbers today and many people said he was lying. It is going to be rough few months here
 
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